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3 UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
IN AND FOR THE EASTERN DISTRICT OF TEXAS
4 MARSHALL DIVISION
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CAROL MIXON and ) CIVIL ACTION NO.
7 BILLY MIXON ) 299CV00092
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8 )
VS. ) MAGISTRATE-JUDGE MCKEE
9 ) JUDGE HEARTFIELD
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10 EQUIFAX CREDIT )
INFORMATION SERVICES, )
11 INC., ET AL )
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16 ORAL DEPOSITION OF BRIAN CUTLER
December 8, 1999
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Reported by Melanie C. Harris, CSR, CCR, RPR
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1 APPEARANCES
2 For the Plaintiff(s):
3 Mr. David A. Szwak
Mr. Brad Smitherman
4 Ms. Mary *bleep*
BODENHEIMER, JONES & SZWAK
5 610 Marshall Street, Suite 905
Shreveport, Louisiana 71101
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For the Defendant Arrow Financial Services:
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Mr. Mitch Motley
8 BROWN MCCARROLL & OAKS HARTLINE, L.L.P.
1127 Judson Road, Suite 220
9 Longview, Texas 75601-5157
10 For the Defendant Experian Information
Solutions, Inc.:
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Ms. Julie C. Jared
12 JONES, DAY, REAVIS & POGUE
2727 North Harwood Street
13 Dallas, Texas 75201-1515
14 -AND-
15 Mr. Daniel J. McLoon
JONES, DAY, REAVIS & POGUE
16 555 West Fifth Street, Suite 4600
Los Angeles, California 90013-1025
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For the Defendant J. C. Penney:
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Mr. William C. Dunnill
19 LAW OFFICES OF JOEL J. STEED
5910 N. Central Expy., Suite 650
20 Dallas, Texas 75206
21 For the Defendant Beneficial:
22 Mr. Jeffrey L. Doggett
KIRKLIN, BOUDREAUX & LEONARD
23 1100 Louisiana, Suite 1400
Houston, Texas 77001-5233
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1 I N D E X
2 WITNESS: BRIAN CUTLER
3 EXAMINATION PAGE NO.
4 By Mr. Szwak. . . . . . . . 5
By Mr. McLoon . . . . . . . 51
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STIPULATIONS. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4
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1 S T I P U L A T I O N S
2 The oral deposition of BRIAN CUTLER, being
3 taken by counsel for Plaintiff, pursuant to Notice
4 before Melanie C. Harris, Certified Shorthand
5 Reporter and Registered Professional Reporter, at
6 the offices of Hanrahan Reporting Service, 2800
7 Youree Drive, Suite C-330 Shreveport, Louisiana, on
8 the 8th day of December, 1999; it being agreed and
9 stipulated by and between counsel that all
10 formalities, with the exception of swearing the
11 witness and the reading and signing of the
12 deposition by deponent, are waived; that
13 objections, except as to the form of the question
14 and the responsiveness of the answer, are reserved
15 to such time as the deposition may be sought to be
16 introduced into evidence in the trial of the case.
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1 BRIAN CUTLER,
2 the witness, having been first duly sworn,
3 testified as follows:
4
5 EXAMINATION
6 MR. SZWAK:
7 Q. Hi, Mr. Cutler. I'm David Szwak. I
8 introduced myself to you. I represent Carol and
9 Billy Mixon in this case. Are you somewhat
10 familiar with this lawsuit?
11 A. Somewhat.
12 Q. Tell me if you can your full name and
13 address.
14 A. Brian Cutler, 602 North Armstrong
15 Court, Buffalo Grove, Illinois 60089.
16 Q. By whom are you employed?
17 A. Arrow Financial Services.
18 Q. What do you do for them?
19 A. I'm the chief technology officer.
20 Q. And what exactly are your job duties
21 there?
22 A. I pretty much make sure the systems,
23 they keep continue to run, et cetera, and I do some
24 operations.
25 Q. Are you part of the management
6
1 structure, or do you actually handle any of the
2 collection activities?
3 A. I handle very little collection
4 activity, mostly management.
5 Q. Do you actually have any collection
6 files that you personally handle?
7 A. I will handle, you know, if there's a
8 dispute.
9 Q. Sometimes if it's a fuss with a
10 customer or consumer?
11 A. Correct.
12 Q. That gives rise for the need for you to
13 intervene and oversee one of the collectors?
14 A. Correct.
15 Q. Do you understand you're responding
16 today on behalf of Arrow Financial Services?
17 A. Yes, I do.
18 Q. Have you been authorized to do so?
19 A. Yes, I have.
20 Q. Have you had a chance to review the
21 Notice of Deposition in the case?
22 A. No, I have not.
23 MR. MOTLEY: I've got it here. We just
24 got that in I think yesterday.
25 Q. (BY MR. SZWAK:) Let me ask you, do you
7
1 believe that you're capable of testifying to the
2 facts involved in this case?
3 A. Yes, I do.
4 Q. How long have you worked for Arrow?
5 A. Twenty years.
6 Q. Are you an owner of the company or --
7 A. Yes, I am.
8 Q. You are an owner of the company?
9 A. Yes, I am.
10 Q. Are you the owner --
11 A. No.
12 Q. -- or are there other owners?
13 A. There's other owners.
14 Q. It's not a public company, is it?
15 A. No, it's not.
16 Q. Are all of your offices located in
17 Illinois?
18 A. No, they are not.
19 Q. You have some in California also?
20 A. One in California, one in Wisconsin.
21 Q. What other states do you have offices
22 in?
23 A. Wisconsin and New York.
24 Q. Are those simply other satellite
25 collection offices, or do they have different
8
1 functions?
2 A. Wisconsin and San Diego are collection
3 offices. New York is they really just do modeling
4 type work.
5 Q. When you say "modeling," what do you
6 mean by that?
7 A. They look at portfolios that we
8 purchase.
9 Q. Is all of the credit reporting aspect
10 conducted in the Illinois office?
11 A. Correct.
12 Q. Did you assist in the compilation of
13 records to produce in this case in the disclosures?
14 A. Yes, I have.
15 Q. Did you have an ability to research all
16 of your records and satisfy yourself that you had
17 produced everything involved in this case?
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. Tell me a little bit about what all
20 Arrow Financial Services does?
21 A. Pretty much we're a collection shop.
22 We do both. We purchase that, and we also do
23 contingency collection work.
24 Q. Do you-all also have your own system in
25 order to report credit reporting information?
9
1 A. We have a package system. It's called
2 Ontario Systems Facs, F-A-C-S.
3 Q. And you report in Metro II format?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. Do you consider credit reporting one of
6 your chief means of collecting debts?
7 A. No.
8 Q. What are your chief means of collecting
9 debts at Arrow?
10 A. Telephone and letter contact.
11 Q. Do you report each of your accounts to
12 the credit bureaus?
13 A. Each of our purchase accounts.
14 Q. So are there any accounts that you
15 don't report to the credit bureaus?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. Which are those?
18 A. The contingency clients.
19 Q. What is the distinction between your
20 straight collections account and your contingent
21 client accounts?
22 A. Contingent clients we do a contingent
23 fee. So no collection. We receive no dollars. If
24 we purchase the account, then we own the account.
25 And same scenario basically though, but the dollars
10
1 are ours to keep.
2 Q. In this particular case did you
3 purchase the fraud related Associates account?
4 A. Yes, we did.
5 Q. I was reviewing the answer that was
6 filed in this case, and I understand that you
7 didn't personally prepare it. I believe Arrow
8 agrees that for some period of time you-all
9 attempted to collect an account which you
10 designated with a number 2747472?
11 A. I would have to look at the notes.
12 That's very possible.
13 Q. If I represent to you that that's the
14 account number from Arrow, you-all did attempt to
15 collect it for some time?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. Tell me how you-all went about
18 collecting this particular account?
19 A. Okay. To be totally honest, from what
20 I've seen on the notes, we really did not do much
21 collection at all. The first letter was returned
22 as a mail return, and the account actually sat
23 there till I believe January of '99 in which we got
24 an incoming call, because we weren't able to do any
25 outbound. We had no information.
11
1 Q. If I understand correctly, the
2 identifiers associated with that particular account
3 were the name Harmane Mixon and an address in
4 Houston, Texas, and my client's Social Security
5 number; is that correct?
6 A. That would be correct.
7 Q. Let me just ask you generally in
8 connection with that account, did you-all make any
9 calls?
10 A. If you have the notes, I would be more
11 than glad to review them.
12 Q. We'll look at that in just a minute.
13 You said do you remember that there were some
14 letters sent?
15 A. Well, no. A letter was sent and
16 returned. That's what I recall, and if we made any
17 calls after the January contact, I would have to
18 look at the notes.
19 Q. The subject letter, is it your
20 understanding that letter was sent to the Houston
21 address?
22 A. I believe so, yes.
23 Q. Did you-all do credit reporting in
24 connection with that account?
25 A. Yes.
12
1 Q. To whom did you report credit
2 information?
3 A. Would have went to all three credit
4 bureaus, which would be Equifax, Transunion, and
5 Experian.
Depo of Arrow in Mixon; Part 1
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David A. Szwak
- Posts: 1974
- Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 11:19 pm
Part 2
6 Q. Were there any other collection
7 activities in connection with that account?
8 A. None that I'm aware of.
9 Q. Based upon your review of all of the
10 records and information at Arrow, do you know of
11 anything that the plaintiffs could have done to
12 resolve this matter insofar as Arrow any better
13 than they did?
14 A. No. I have no idea what they could
15 have done.
16 Q. Do you feel like that from your review
17 of all the records that when Mrs. Mixon contacted
18 you that she accurately conveyed to you what the
19 problem was?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. Do you know of any reason that you
22 might believe that somehow the Mixons were at fault
23 in causing this problem?
24 A. I have no idea.
25 Q. Would you agree with me that the harm
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1 that came upon the plaintiffs in this case was as a
2 result of the credit reporting aspect of the
3 collection activity?
4 A. Would I agree that the harm?
5 Q. Right.
6 A. I can only assume that to be the case.
7 Q. In the review of the records that
8 you've looked at, was that pretty much Mrs. Mixon's
9 principal complaint --
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. -- that there was credit reporting, and
12 it was on her credit report, right?
13 A. Correct.
14 Q. Have you-all brought any claims against
15 Associates Financial Services in connection with
16 them providing you an account which was fraud
17 related?
18 A. By claim what do you mean, litigation,
19 filed suit?
20 Q. Litigation or demand upon them to
21 purchase the account back?
22 A. We've done a demand as far as there is
23 in the contract a hold harmless agreement.
24 Q. So then they would be responsible back
25 to you for your purchase price of the account?
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1 A. Correct.
2 Q. Can you generally describe for me the
3 relationship between Arrow and Associates
4 Financial?
5 A. There's a -- they are a -- what would
6 they be. They would be our -- they would be a
7 customer in which -- actually we're their
8 customer. We would purchase their --
9 Q. There's no ownership, common ownership
10 between these entities?
11 A. No.
12 Q. It's just a straight customer
13 relationship with them?
14 A. That is correct.
15 Q. Do you know when you-all obtained that
16 fraud related Associates' account?
17 A. Again, from my recollection I believe
18 it was purchased February of '98, and, again, if I
19 can see the notes, I would be able to give you
20 exact dates.
21 Q. Is that roughly when you remember it?
22 A. That's what I recall.
23 Q. Did you-all acquire it in a bulk
24 transfer, or was it a single account that you
25 purchased?
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1 A. Bulk transfer.
2 Q. Did anyone at Associates ever inform
3 you that they were aware of some prior disputes
4 pertaining to that account?
5 A. No.
6 Q. When it was sold to you, it was sold as
7 a valid outstanding account?
8 A. Correct.
9 Q. And you had no idea that the plaintiffs
10 had previously disputed this matter to credit
11 reporting agencies and/or Associates?
12 A. Correct. We had no idea.
13 Q. I've got your records that you provided
14 us in your disclosure.
15 A. Okay.
16 Q. So that you may refer to them if you
17 need to. Can you review your records and tell me
18 exactly what you-all did when you first got the
19 account and when you actually got it?
20 A. We first actually listed it on our
21 computer system February 12th, 1998. Therefore, we
22 probably would have received the account I would
23 guess approximately a week prior to that date.
24 Q. Did you-all send out any letters
25 according to your notes?
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1 A. First letter was sent on February 19th,
2 1998.
3 Q. Were there any phone calls made at that
4 time?
5 A. No. There were none.
6 Q. Did you ever make any phone calls to
7 any of the telephone numbers listed?
8 A. No, we did not.
9 Q. There was never any phone call made?
10 A. No, sir.
11 Q. How many total letters went out in
12 connection with this account?
13 A. One letter.
14 Q. In this particular case did you
15 authorize all three of the credit bureaus to report
16 your data on a monthly basis, or how often did you
17 report it?
18 A. We reported it monthly.
19 Q. And you're familiar with the fact that
20 the credit reporting agencies then disseminate that
21 information on to other subscribers and persons who
22 request the person's credit report?
23 A. That's correct.
24 Q. What is the status of the information
25 that you reported in connection with that account?
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1 Is it reported as a collection with an R-9 rating?
2 A. No. It's reported as a collection
3 account.
4 Q. Do you actually assign a nine rating to
5 those accounts, or does the credit reporting
6 agency?
7 A. No. It's not reported with any kind of
8 rating. It's reported under a collection account.
9 Rating systems are used for the creditors.
10 Q. According to the records at your
11 company, when did you-all first learn that
12 Mrs. Mixon was complaining about this information
13 appearing on her credit reports?
14 A. January 5th, 1999.
15 Q. And how did you learn about that?
16 A. Mrs. Mixon phoned the office.
17 Q. And do you have some notes which you
18 can decode for me and tell me what Mrs. Mixon said
19 to your company?
20 A. Customer called; her name
21 Carolyn Henderson Mixon; said she's disputing this,
22 that she has several other accounts opened by
23 somebody with her Social; advised her to send
24 letter of dispute. Social Security number is hers.
25 Q. Would those notes reflect that she was
18
1 complaining about an application fraud situation?
2 A. I would assume so.
3 Q. Who spoke to Carol at that time?
4 A. Emma DeLeon.
5 Q. Was she a collector assigned to that
6 particular account?
7 A. I do not know.
8 Q. Do you-all have that situation at your
9 company where a particular account is assigned to a
10 particular collector, or are they just generally
11 handled by whomever picks up the phone?
12 A. Yeah. An incoming call like that, it's
13 anybody could actually have handled the account.
14 Q. What was Ms. DeLeon's title?
15 A. She's a collector.
16 Q. As a result of Mrs. Mixon's dispute,
17 did you-all conduct any reinvestigation of her
18 complaint on January 5?
19 A. No. Actually Ms. DeLeon I believe
20 Mrs. Mixon moved the account into a disputed
21 disposition code.
22 Q. Now moving it into a disputed
23 disposition code would prevent you-all from
24 engaging in any letter writing or affirmative calls
25 to Mrs. Mixon, right?
19
1 A. Correct.
2 Q. That would not cease any credit
3 reporting, would it?
4 A. Well, yes, it would.
5 Q. Would it actually retract prior credit
6 reportings by the company?
7 A. Yes, it would.
8 Q. So as of January 5, 1999, you-all would
9 have issued notice to each of the three credit
10 reporting agencies to cease any previous reportings
11 by your company?
12 A. That would be correct.
13 Q. And it would certainly terminate any
14 future reportings by your company?
15 A. That is correct.
16 Q. Now, subsequent to January 5 of 1999,
17 did you-all ever take any other action with regard
18 to the credit reporting issue?
19 A. No, we did not.
20 Q. So after January 5, 1999, you never
21 wrote the credit bureaus again or made any other
22 affirmative reporting to them by way of tape?
23 A. Well, we wrote them in October.
24 Q. And you're referring to Arrow document
25 No. 6 which is a UDF form?
20
1 A. Correct.
2 Q. Universal data form?
3 A. Correct.
4 Q. And on October 13 of 1999, did you
5 submit Arrow No. 6 to the three credit reporting
6 agencies, Equifax, Experian, and Transunion?
7 A. Yes, we did.
8 Q. And what was the purpose of the
9 universal data form?
10 A. I got a phone call from Mr. Motley
11 telling me that the information was still on
12 Mrs. Mixon's report and asked us to issue the form.
13 Q. And you-all indicated to the credit
14 reporting agencies on October 13 of 1999, that the
15 information had been reported in error and that you
16 wished to have it removed?
17 A. Correct.
7 activities in connection with that account?
8 A. None that I'm aware of.
9 Q. Based upon your review of all of the
10 records and information at Arrow, do you know of
11 anything that the plaintiffs could have done to
12 resolve this matter insofar as Arrow any better
13 than they did?
14 A. No. I have no idea what they could
15 have done.
16 Q. Do you feel like that from your review
17 of all the records that when Mrs. Mixon contacted
18 you that she accurately conveyed to you what the
19 problem was?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. Do you know of any reason that you
22 might believe that somehow the Mixons were at fault
23 in causing this problem?
24 A. I have no idea.
25 Q. Would you agree with me that the harm
13
1 that came upon the plaintiffs in this case was as a
2 result of the credit reporting aspect of the
3 collection activity?
4 A. Would I agree that the harm?
5 Q. Right.
6 A. I can only assume that to be the case.
7 Q. In the review of the records that
8 you've looked at, was that pretty much Mrs. Mixon's
9 principal complaint --
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. -- that there was credit reporting, and
12 it was on her credit report, right?
13 A. Correct.
14 Q. Have you-all brought any claims against
15 Associates Financial Services in connection with
16 them providing you an account which was fraud
17 related?
18 A. By claim what do you mean, litigation,
19 filed suit?
20 Q. Litigation or demand upon them to
21 purchase the account back?
22 A. We've done a demand as far as there is
23 in the contract a hold harmless agreement.
24 Q. So then they would be responsible back
25 to you for your purchase price of the account?
14
1 A. Correct.
2 Q. Can you generally describe for me the
3 relationship between Arrow and Associates
4 Financial?
5 A. There's a -- they are a -- what would
6 they be. They would be our -- they would be a
7 customer in which -- actually we're their
8 customer. We would purchase their --
9 Q. There's no ownership, common ownership
10 between these entities?
11 A. No.
12 Q. It's just a straight customer
13 relationship with them?
14 A. That is correct.
15 Q. Do you know when you-all obtained that
16 fraud related Associates' account?
17 A. Again, from my recollection I believe
18 it was purchased February of '98, and, again, if I
19 can see the notes, I would be able to give you
20 exact dates.
21 Q. Is that roughly when you remember it?
22 A. That's what I recall.
23 Q. Did you-all acquire it in a bulk
24 transfer, or was it a single account that you
25 purchased?
15
1 A. Bulk transfer.
2 Q. Did anyone at Associates ever inform
3 you that they were aware of some prior disputes
4 pertaining to that account?
5 A. No.
6 Q. When it was sold to you, it was sold as
7 a valid outstanding account?
8 A. Correct.
9 Q. And you had no idea that the plaintiffs
10 had previously disputed this matter to credit
11 reporting agencies and/or Associates?
12 A. Correct. We had no idea.
13 Q. I've got your records that you provided
14 us in your disclosure.
15 A. Okay.
16 Q. So that you may refer to them if you
17 need to. Can you review your records and tell me
18 exactly what you-all did when you first got the
19 account and when you actually got it?
20 A. We first actually listed it on our
21 computer system February 12th, 1998. Therefore, we
22 probably would have received the account I would
23 guess approximately a week prior to that date.
24 Q. Did you-all send out any letters
25 according to your notes?
16
1 A. First letter was sent on February 19th,
2 1998.
3 Q. Were there any phone calls made at that
4 time?
5 A. No. There were none.
6 Q. Did you ever make any phone calls to
7 any of the telephone numbers listed?
8 A. No, we did not.
9 Q. There was never any phone call made?
10 A. No, sir.
11 Q. How many total letters went out in
12 connection with this account?
13 A. One letter.
14 Q. In this particular case did you
15 authorize all three of the credit bureaus to report
16 your data on a monthly basis, or how often did you
17 report it?
18 A. We reported it monthly.
19 Q. And you're familiar with the fact that
20 the credit reporting agencies then disseminate that
21 information on to other subscribers and persons who
22 request the person's credit report?
23 A. That's correct.
24 Q. What is the status of the information
25 that you reported in connection with that account?
17
1 Is it reported as a collection with an R-9 rating?
2 A. No. It's reported as a collection
3 account.
4 Q. Do you actually assign a nine rating to
5 those accounts, or does the credit reporting
6 agency?
7 A. No. It's not reported with any kind of
8 rating. It's reported under a collection account.
9 Rating systems are used for the creditors.
10 Q. According to the records at your
11 company, when did you-all first learn that
12 Mrs. Mixon was complaining about this information
13 appearing on her credit reports?
14 A. January 5th, 1999.
15 Q. And how did you learn about that?
16 A. Mrs. Mixon phoned the office.
17 Q. And do you have some notes which you
18 can decode for me and tell me what Mrs. Mixon said
19 to your company?
20 A. Customer called; her name
21 Carolyn Henderson Mixon; said she's disputing this,
22 that she has several other accounts opened by
23 somebody with her Social; advised her to send
24 letter of dispute. Social Security number is hers.
25 Q. Would those notes reflect that she was
18
1 complaining about an application fraud situation?
2 A. I would assume so.
3 Q. Who spoke to Carol at that time?
4 A. Emma DeLeon.
5 Q. Was she a collector assigned to that
6 particular account?
7 A. I do not know.
8 Q. Do you-all have that situation at your
9 company where a particular account is assigned to a
10 particular collector, or are they just generally
11 handled by whomever picks up the phone?
12 A. Yeah. An incoming call like that, it's
13 anybody could actually have handled the account.
14 Q. What was Ms. DeLeon's title?
15 A. She's a collector.
16 Q. As a result of Mrs. Mixon's dispute,
17 did you-all conduct any reinvestigation of her
18 complaint on January 5?
19 A. No. Actually Ms. DeLeon I believe
20 Mrs. Mixon moved the account into a disputed
21 disposition code.
22 Q. Now moving it into a disputed
23 disposition code would prevent you-all from
24 engaging in any letter writing or affirmative calls
25 to Mrs. Mixon, right?
19
1 A. Correct.
2 Q. That would not cease any credit
3 reporting, would it?
4 A. Well, yes, it would.
5 Q. Would it actually retract prior credit
6 reportings by the company?
7 A. Yes, it would.
8 Q. So as of January 5, 1999, you-all would
9 have issued notice to each of the three credit
10 reporting agencies to cease any previous reportings
11 by your company?
12 A. That would be correct.
13 Q. And it would certainly terminate any
14 future reportings by your company?
15 A. That is correct.
16 Q. Now, subsequent to January 5 of 1999,
17 did you-all ever take any other action with regard
18 to the credit reporting issue?
19 A. No, we did not.
20 Q. So after January 5, 1999, you never
21 wrote the credit bureaus again or made any other
22 affirmative reporting to them by way of tape?
23 A. Well, we wrote them in October.
24 Q. And you're referring to Arrow document
25 No. 6 which is a UDF form?
20
1 A. Correct.
2 Q. Universal data form?
3 A. Correct.
4 Q. And on October 13 of 1999, did you
5 submit Arrow No. 6 to the three credit reporting
6 agencies, Equifax, Experian, and Transunion?
7 A. Yes, we did.
8 Q. And what was the purpose of the
9 universal data form?
10 A. I got a phone call from Mr. Motley
11 telling me that the information was still on
12 Mrs. Mixon's report and asked us to issue the form.
13 Q. And you-all indicated to the credit
14 reporting agencies on October 13 of 1999, that the
15 information had been reported in error and that you
16 wished to have it removed?
17 A. Correct.
-
David A. Szwak
- Posts: 1974
- Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 11:19 pm
Part 3
18 Q. Now if I understand, between January 5
19 of 1999 and October 13 of 1999, in that time
20 period, there were no actions taken by Arrow
21 Financial Services to affirmatively report any
22 information in connection with the account, nor any
23 action taken in order to retract any information
24 previously reported; is that correct?
25 A. That would be correct.
21
1 Q. When this lawsuit was filed by the
2 Mixons in federal court in Texas, did you actually
3 receive a copy of the complaint?
4 A. I don't know.
5 Q. When is the first time that you saw any
6 document pertaining to the lawsuit that had been
7 filed?
8 A. Pertaining to it itself I have not seen
9 anything that's been actually filed, just have been
10 informed about it.
11 Q. From your records does it indicate that
12 your company received a copy of this lawsuit in or
13 about May of 1999?
14 A. No, it does not.
15 Q. No?
16 A. No.
17 Q. Have you ever seen the actual complaint
18 that was filed in this case?
19 A. No, I have not.
20 Q. Subsequent to May of 1999, did anyone
21 actually review this particular account to review
22 the complaints raised in the lawsuit?
23 A. I do not know for a fact. I would
24 assume our general counsel did though.
25 Q. What is the name of the general
22
1 counsel?
2 A. Lance Martin.
3 Q. And I don't want you to disclose to me
4 any communications between you and your attorney,
5 but if I understand correctly, you were made aware
6 that some of the national credit reporting agencies
7 were still reporting the fraud related Arrow
8 collection account in October of 1999?
9 A. That is correct.
10 Q. And at that time you took the steps to
11 submit a universal data form?
12 A. That is correct.
13 Q. Is Ms. DeLeon still employed by your
14 company?
15 A. Yes, she is.
16 Q. And is she in the California office or
17 the Illinois office?
18 A. California.
19 Q. Do your records indicate that
20 Ms. DeLeon had been contacted by any third persons
21 in connection with the fraud related account?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. Tell me about those contacts.
24 A. Credco--and I'm not sure if that's a
25 company or that's just an abbreviation--called to
23
1 verify the Social Security of the customer; told
2 lady I cannot release information without
3 customer's authorization.
4 Q. What date was that contact?
5 A. January 5th.
6 Q. So if I understand correctly, on
7 January 5 Mrs. Mixon called, and she was
8 complaining about the Arrow account, the fraud
9 related account; is that correct?
10 A. That is correct.
11 Q. And then also on January 5th, Credco,
12 which I'll represent to you is a mortgage reporting
13 company, contacted you-all in order to try to
14 verify the Social Security number of Mrs. Mixon?
15 A. Correct. Credco actually called first.
16 Q. Credco called you first, and then
17 Mrs. Mixon followed up?
18 A. Yes. After Credco was given the
19 information that we would not release any
20 information because of third party disclosure, my
21 assumption is that Credco contacted Mrs. Mixon.
22 Mrs. Mixon then contacted us.
23 Q. Let me ask you, on January 5 of 1999,
24 when you-all notified the credit reporting agencies
25 to retract the prior reportings, how was that done?
24
1 A. That would have been done via the tape.
2 Q. In your investigation in connection
3 with this lawsuit and your testimony today, have
4 you found any records which indicate that you-all
5 did actually notify the credit reporting agencies
6 to delete the information on January 5?
7 A. Yeah. According to the notes on the
8 system the credit reporting flag was changed from
9 yes to no which would create a deletion record.
10 Q. It would create a deletion record
11 automatically?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. And then that deletion record would be
14 then transmitted to all three of the credit
15 reporting agencies?
16 A. That would be correct.
17 Q. What difference would there be between
18 changing the tape reporting and the universal data
19 form?
20 A. One is automated. One is not.
21 Q. So you-all attempted to in an automated
22 fashion delete the information on January 5 of
23 1999, and then later in October when you found out
24 that it had not been deleted, you went through the
25 manual process?
25
1 A. That is correct.
2 Q. Did you ever receive any verification
3 from the three credit reporting agencies that they
4 had taken care of this in October?
5 A. No, we have not.
6 Q. Did you find that Ms. DeLeon had any
7 other conversations with third persons other than
8 Credco?
9 A. No. Ms. DeLeon did not talk to any
10 other third party.
11 Q. Did she have any subsequent
12 conversations with Mrs. Mixon?
13 A. Yes, she did.
14 Q. On what date would that have been?
15 A. January 11th.
16 Q. So this would be roughly six days
17 later?
18 A. Correct.
19 Q. And can you tell me from your records
20 what the substance of the conversation was?
21 A. Customer called again; told she's
22 sending documents by fax; told she's building a
23 house, and this is on her credit. She complained
24 about it; cannot decipher what that means after she
25 complained about it; asked if she would like to
26
1 settle in full, told no; then she started using
2 foul language; told her she doesn't have to do foul
3 language; then she asks for SU, which is
4 supervisor; later on she hung up.
5 Q. It sounds to me like from the notes
6 that Mrs. Mixon called again and was really
7 pressing your company to take care of this credit
8 reporting matter; is that true?
9 A. I don't know.
10 Q. Well, she had called you back for the
11 purpose of continuing to complain that this
12 information was appearing on her mortgage report?
13 A. That is correct. Right.
14 Q. And in connection with that, at some
15 point Ms. DeLeon asked Mrs. Mixon if she would like
16 to settle and pay the account in full; is that
17 true?
18 A. She did look -- yes. She did ask for a
19 settlement.
20 Q. If Mrs. Mixon had been complaining that
21 this was a fraud account, there would be no reason
22 for her to have to pay that account, would it?
23 A. No. There would not be.
24 Q. Why would -- I mean, would it be part
25 of the practices of Arrow Financial Services to
27
1 suggest to a fraud victim that they are responsible
2 for the account, maybe if they paid it in full,
3 they could get it taken care of faster?
4 A. No.
5 Q. When you reviewed those notes in the
6 record, is that in keeping with the practices at
7 Arrow Financial Services?
8 A. Is what in keeping?
9 Q. Suggesting to Mrs. Mixon that she
10 should settle the account in full?
11 A. I don't know how the conversation went,
12 so I have no idea.
13 Q. Assuming that Mrs. Mixon had related to
14 Ms. DeLeon that this was causing her a tremendous
15 amount of problem in trying to obtain a mortgage,
16 that Arrow was reporting on the mortgage report,
17 and Ms. DeLeon responded in kind by suggesting that
18 Mrs. Mixon pay the account in full, do you think
19 that if Mrs. Mixon became quite irate that that
20 would be an unreasonable thing for her to have
21 responded?
22 A. If that's what happened, no, I wouldn't
23 think so at all.
24 Q. Now, can you tell me at what point or
25 if any did David Williams actually handle this
28
1 particular account for your company?
2 A. David Williams, I do not see any notes
3 from David Williams on this.
4 Q. What about Andrea Wheeler, did she ever
5 become involved in this account?
6 A. Looks like possibly on 6/1/99.
7 Q. What was occurring on that particular
8 day?
9 A. Says assignee phoned in; wanted to know
10 if customer gave any info on account to us; gave
11 her all the info we have; requested account being
12 fraud; said she's faxing us statement.
13 Q. The assignee on the account would be
14 who?
15 A. Associates.
16 Q. And they had phoned you-all for what
17 purpose?
18 A. I don't have enough notes to tell you.
19 Evidently something happened.
20 Q. According to the notes that are there
21 in your records, does that make any sense to you
22 what was occurring on June 1 of 999?
23 A. It seems like at that point the
24 assignee, being Associates, must have determined it
25 to be a fraud and didn't want us to do any further
29
1 collection itself.
2 Q. And what was Arrow's response to
3 Associates on that date?
4 A. We had already -- it was already
5 considered a fraud to us. So nothing more for us
6 to do.
7 Q. And Andrea Wheeler would have been the
8 person who communicated with Associates on that
9 date?
10 A. That would be correct.
11 Q. Is that the only activity Ms. Wheeler
12 had in connection with that account?
13 A. That is correct.
14 Q. Now can you tell me if Emma Guillerma
15 was involved in way in that account?
16 A. Guillerma and DeLeon is the same.
17 Q. They're the same person? That's
18 Ms. DeLeon?
19 A. Correct.
20 Q. What about Andrew, is it Vigara?
21 A. Yes. Yes. He handled a call on
22 January 11th.
23 Q. When you say he handled the call on
24 January 11, was that the call with Mrs. Mixon?
25 A. Yes.
19 of 1999 and October 13 of 1999, in that time
20 period, there were no actions taken by Arrow
21 Financial Services to affirmatively report any
22 information in connection with the account, nor any
23 action taken in order to retract any information
24 previously reported; is that correct?
25 A. That would be correct.
21
1 Q. When this lawsuit was filed by the
2 Mixons in federal court in Texas, did you actually
3 receive a copy of the complaint?
4 A. I don't know.
5 Q. When is the first time that you saw any
6 document pertaining to the lawsuit that had been
7 filed?
8 A. Pertaining to it itself I have not seen
9 anything that's been actually filed, just have been
10 informed about it.
11 Q. From your records does it indicate that
12 your company received a copy of this lawsuit in or
13 about May of 1999?
14 A. No, it does not.
15 Q. No?
16 A. No.
17 Q. Have you ever seen the actual complaint
18 that was filed in this case?
19 A. No, I have not.
20 Q. Subsequent to May of 1999, did anyone
21 actually review this particular account to review
22 the complaints raised in the lawsuit?
23 A. I do not know for a fact. I would
24 assume our general counsel did though.
25 Q. What is the name of the general
22
1 counsel?
2 A. Lance Martin.
3 Q. And I don't want you to disclose to me
4 any communications between you and your attorney,
5 but if I understand correctly, you were made aware
6 that some of the national credit reporting agencies
7 were still reporting the fraud related Arrow
8 collection account in October of 1999?
9 A. That is correct.
10 Q. And at that time you took the steps to
11 submit a universal data form?
12 A. That is correct.
13 Q. Is Ms. DeLeon still employed by your
14 company?
15 A. Yes, she is.
16 Q. And is she in the California office or
17 the Illinois office?
18 A. California.
19 Q. Do your records indicate that
20 Ms. DeLeon had been contacted by any third persons
21 in connection with the fraud related account?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. Tell me about those contacts.
24 A. Credco--and I'm not sure if that's a
25 company or that's just an abbreviation--called to
23
1 verify the Social Security of the customer; told
2 lady I cannot release information without
3 customer's authorization.
4 Q. What date was that contact?
5 A. January 5th.
6 Q. So if I understand correctly, on
7 January 5 Mrs. Mixon called, and she was
8 complaining about the Arrow account, the fraud
9 related account; is that correct?
10 A. That is correct.
11 Q. And then also on January 5th, Credco,
12 which I'll represent to you is a mortgage reporting
13 company, contacted you-all in order to try to
14 verify the Social Security number of Mrs. Mixon?
15 A. Correct. Credco actually called first.
16 Q. Credco called you first, and then
17 Mrs. Mixon followed up?
18 A. Yes. After Credco was given the
19 information that we would not release any
20 information because of third party disclosure, my
21 assumption is that Credco contacted Mrs. Mixon.
22 Mrs. Mixon then contacted us.
23 Q. Let me ask you, on January 5 of 1999,
24 when you-all notified the credit reporting agencies
25 to retract the prior reportings, how was that done?
24
1 A. That would have been done via the tape.
2 Q. In your investigation in connection
3 with this lawsuit and your testimony today, have
4 you found any records which indicate that you-all
5 did actually notify the credit reporting agencies
6 to delete the information on January 5?
7 A. Yeah. According to the notes on the
8 system the credit reporting flag was changed from
9 yes to no which would create a deletion record.
10 Q. It would create a deletion record
11 automatically?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. And then that deletion record would be
14 then transmitted to all three of the credit
15 reporting agencies?
16 A. That would be correct.
17 Q. What difference would there be between
18 changing the tape reporting and the universal data
19 form?
20 A. One is automated. One is not.
21 Q. So you-all attempted to in an automated
22 fashion delete the information on January 5 of
23 1999, and then later in October when you found out
24 that it had not been deleted, you went through the
25 manual process?
25
1 A. That is correct.
2 Q. Did you ever receive any verification
3 from the three credit reporting agencies that they
4 had taken care of this in October?
5 A. No, we have not.
6 Q. Did you find that Ms. DeLeon had any
7 other conversations with third persons other than
8 Credco?
9 A. No. Ms. DeLeon did not talk to any
10 other third party.
11 Q. Did she have any subsequent
12 conversations with Mrs. Mixon?
13 A. Yes, she did.
14 Q. On what date would that have been?
15 A. January 11th.
16 Q. So this would be roughly six days
17 later?
18 A. Correct.
19 Q. And can you tell me from your records
20 what the substance of the conversation was?
21 A. Customer called again; told she's
22 sending documents by fax; told she's building a
23 house, and this is on her credit. She complained
24 about it; cannot decipher what that means after she
25 complained about it; asked if she would like to
26
1 settle in full, told no; then she started using
2 foul language; told her she doesn't have to do foul
3 language; then she asks for SU, which is
4 supervisor; later on she hung up.
5 Q. It sounds to me like from the notes
6 that Mrs. Mixon called again and was really
7 pressing your company to take care of this credit
8 reporting matter; is that true?
9 A. I don't know.
10 Q. Well, she had called you back for the
11 purpose of continuing to complain that this
12 information was appearing on her mortgage report?
13 A. That is correct. Right.
14 Q. And in connection with that, at some
15 point Ms. DeLeon asked Mrs. Mixon if she would like
16 to settle and pay the account in full; is that
17 true?
18 A. She did look -- yes. She did ask for a
19 settlement.
20 Q. If Mrs. Mixon had been complaining that
21 this was a fraud account, there would be no reason
22 for her to have to pay that account, would it?
23 A. No. There would not be.
24 Q. Why would -- I mean, would it be part
25 of the practices of Arrow Financial Services to
27
1 suggest to a fraud victim that they are responsible
2 for the account, maybe if they paid it in full,
3 they could get it taken care of faster?
4 A. No.
5 Q. When you reviewed those notes in the
6 record, is that in keeping with the practices at
7 Arrow Financial Services?
8 A. Is what in keeping?
9 Q. Suggesting to Mrs. Mixon that she
10 should settle the account in full?
11 A. I don't know how the conversation went,
12 so I have no idea.
13 Q. Assuming that Mrs. Mixon had related to
14 Ms. DeLeon that this was causing her a tremendous
15 amount of problem in trying to obtain a mortgage,
16 that Arrow was reporting on the mortgage report,
17 and Ms. DeLeon responded in kind by suggesting that
18 Mrs. Mixon pay the account in full, do you think
19 that if Mrs. Mixon became quite irate that that
20 would be an unreasonable thing for her to have
21 responded?
22 A. If that's what happened, no, I wouldn't
23 think so at all.
24 Q. Now, can you tell me at what point or
25 if any did David Williams actually handle this
28
1 particular account for your company?
2 A. David Williams, I do not see any notes
3 from David Williams on this.
4 Q. What about Andrea Wheeler, did she ever
5 become involved in this account?
6 A. Looks like possibly on 6/1/99.
7 Q. What was occurring on that particular
8 day?
9 A. Says assignee phoned in; wanted to know
10 if customer gave any info on account to us; gave
11 her all the info we have; requested account being
12 fraud; said she's faxing us statement.
13 Q. The assignee on the account would be
14 who?
15 A. Associates.
16 Q. And they had phoned you-all for what
17 purpose?
18 A. I don't have enough notes to tell you.
19 Evidently something happened.
20 Q. According to the notes that are there
21 in your records, does that make any sense to you
22 what was occurring on June 1 of 999?
23 A. It seems like at that point the
24 assignee, being Associates, must have determined it
25 to be a fraud and didn't want us to do any further
29
1 collection itself.
2 Q. And what was Arrow's response to
3 Associates on that date?
4 A. We had already -- it was already
5 considered a fraud to us. So nothing more for us
6 to do.
7 Q. And Andrea Wheeler would have been the
8 person who communicated with Associates on that
9 date?
10 A. That would be correct.
11 Q. Is that the only activity Ms. Wheeler
12 had in connection with that account?
13 A. That is correct.
14 Q. Now can you tell me if Emma Guillerma
15 was involved in way in that account?
16 A. Guillerma and DeLeon is the same.
17 Q. They're the same person? That's
18 Ms. DeLeon?
19 A. Correct.
20 Q. What about Andrew, is it Vigara?
21 A. Yes. Yes. He handled a call on
22 January 11th.
23 Q. When you say he handled the call on
24 January 11, was that the call with Mrs. Mixon?
25 A. Yes.
-
David A. Szwak
- Posts: 1974
- Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 11:19 pm
Part 4
30
1 Q. Was he the Arrow Representative who
2 suggested to her that she should pay the account in
3 full?
4 A. He's the supervisor, and his notes
5 indicate her name is Carol Mixon; Social Security
6 number is hers but never heard of Harmane or
7 Charmane, aside from seeing the name on other fraud
8 accounts; previous address on file is a vacant
9 building; disputing party has already followed up
10 on info.
11 Q. Would it be correct to say that
12 Mrs. Mixon had talked to Ms. DeLeon on January 11.
13 She became quite irate and asked to speak to the
14 supervisor, and then ultimately Andrew got on the
15 phone with her. And Mrs. Mixon again conveyed her
16 complaints regarding the Arrow account?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. What action did Andrew take as a result
19 of his communication with her on January 11?
20 A. Again, he left the account in the
21 disputed disposition. He had made the note that
22 she had already followed up and sent the
23 information in.
24 Q. Is it true that Mrs. Mixon faxed to
25 your company by telefax on January 5, 1999, all of
31
1 the information you-all had requested in the form
2 of a police report and a letter of dispute?
3 A. I don't have firsthand information on
4 that.
5 Q. I believe it's right here on Arrow
6 No. 1 with a fax ledger showing your fax?
7 A. Then she would have faxed it that day
8 then.
9 Q. So you-all did receive it at that time?
10 A. I can assume so, yes.
11 Q. Did Carmen Larson ever become involved
12 in this particular account?
13 A. No.
14 Q. What is Carmen's job title with Arrow?
15 A. She's clerical staff in our Wisconsin
16 office.
17 Q. Does she handle the credit reporting
18 function --
19 A. No.
20 Q. -- or any -- she's just simply a
21 clerical?
22 A. Clerical person.
23 Q. What about Marian Saylers who's
24 identified on Arrow No. 4?
25 MR. MOTLEY: Where is it, David?
32
1 MR. SZWAK: Right there. Your pen is
2 almost on top of it.
3 THE WITNESS: No. She had no contact
4 with the party. She was the actual account member
5 that was assigned to it.
6 Q. (BY MR. SZWAK:) Now the letter that
7 Mrs. Mixon sent to you-all on January 5 of 1999,
8 which I believe is Arrow Document No. 1?
9 A. Okay.
10 Q. Are you satisfied that that's a good
11 and accurate dispute by Mrs. Mixon?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. And did she also fax to you on Arrow
14 Document No. 2 and 3 a copy of the Houston police
15 report that she was able to obtain?
16 A. Yes. Those were faxed on January 12th.
17 Q. Okay. You received those documents on
18 January 12?
19 A. Correct.
20 Q. That's according to the telefax?
21 A. To the telefax.
22 Q. The letter is dated January 11?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. On your Arrow Document No. 4 there is a
25 area which is designated by 2, capital DSP,
33
1 disputed account, no CBR, can you tell me -- can
2 you decode that information for me?
3 A. She moved the account into the -- it
4 was removed from a route group from the credit
5 bureau through what we call an SM, being smart
6 disposition to DSP. So that means as soon as it
7 goes into that disposition the system creates a
8 deletion record and reported the -- change the
9 report to credit bureau from a Y to an N.
10 Q. And that was all on January 5?
11 A. That's correct.
12 Q. Let me ask you, there's an April 6 of
13 1998 notation showing it was transferred from ATM
14 to AMS. Can you decode that for me?
15 A. April?
16 Q. 6th.
17 MR. MOTLEY: Yeah, '98, right here.
18 THE WITNESS: That's just a collector
19 transfer, would have gone from one collector's unit
20 to another collector's unit.
21 Q. (BY MR. SZWAK:) What are those two
22 different units that are listed there?
23 A. I would have to look them up. I do not
24 know. They are two collectors within the company.
25 So they may have been -- the account may have
34
1 resided in one office, and then would have been
2 transferred to another office.
3 Q. From your review of that record if the
4 account were absolutely frozen as of January 5 of
5 1999, there was to be no further collection
6 activity and no further credit reportings of any
7 kind, was there any reason for there to be some
8 activity in transferring this file between
9 collectors?
10 A. It was transferred before the issue of
11 January. This was transferred April of '98.
12 Q. April of '98?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. If I understand correctly, after
15 you-all sent the first letter sometime in February
16 of '98, and it came back that no one accepted it at
17 the address, you-all stopped sending letters on
18 that account?
19 A. That's correct.
20 Q. The collector who is notated by as ED3,
21 is that Ms. DeLeon?
22 A. That is correct.
23 Q. And the collector noted as AV3, which
24 collector is that?
25 A. That's Andrew.
35
1 Q. On January 11 there was a reference to
2 the disputing party already has F/U on information,
3 what does that mean?
4 A. Follow up, that they follow up, they
5 send in the information.
6 Q. Was that an indication that Mrs. Mixon
7 had complied with your request?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. Now on June 14 of 1999, was there a
10 communication with Rels Reporting Company, another
11 mortgage reporting company?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. Can you decode that for me and tell me
14 what the substance of that communication was?
15 A. Randall from Rels Reporting Service
16 stated customer is trying to get report of CBR.
17 Rhonda stated customer -- looks like she just says
18 it was a fraud, but her name and Social Security
19 number are the same. And they have said customer
20 should be calling to get this taken care of very
21 soon.
22 Q. So Rels Reporting indicated to you
23 again that Mrs. Mixon was complaining about some
24 fraud related accounts on her report?
25 A. That's what it looks like.
36
1 Q. And did she indicate to you at that
2 time that there was an Arrow account on the report?
3 A. No information relating to that in the
4 notes. I don't know.
5 Q. Would there be any other reason for
6 Rels Reporting to be contacting you in June of 1999
7 if you had already deleted it in January of '99?
8 A. No.
9 Q. Would it be safe to assume that Rels
10 Reporting contacted you-all because your account
11 was still appearing on Mrs. Mixon's credit report?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. There's an indication down here that
14 Rels Reporting indicated to Arrow that the
15 customer, Mrs. Mixon, should have been calling to
16 get this taken care of very soon; is that correct?
17 A. That is correct.
18 Q. But according to your own records,
19 Mrs. Mixon had already been in contact with you
20 with regard to this matter, correct?
21 A. That is correct.
22 Q. What was done on June 14 of 1999 in
23 order to look into this phone call from Rels
24 Reporting?
25 A. File was left in the dispute history.
37
1 Q. If Arrow was put on notice in June of
2 1999 that their account was still being reported,
3 and Rels Reporting contacted them in order to
4 discuss Mrs. Mixon's dispute; and you had in your
5 fingertips notes indicating that you believe that
6 you had previously deleted it through tape
7 reporting, was there any process in order to follow
8 up on this and find out why this is still appearing
9 on this lady's credit report?
10 A. I would have to look up who handled
11 that. WA2 handled it. I have no idea who that
12 would be.
13 Q. In your disclosure, do we have the
14 identity of the person who is WA2? Do you know who
15 that is in the company structure?
16 A. No, not without looking it up.
17 Q. I would assume that the designator
18 three means the California office?
19 A. Correct.
20 Q. Is that correct?
21 A. That's correct.
22 Q. Which means the number two designator
23 must mean some other office of Arrow, true?
24 A. Wisconsin.
25 Q. Would that be the Illinois office,
38
1 New York office, Wisconsin office?
2 A. Wisconsin.
3 Q. Now why would the Wisconsin office be
4 working on this particular file if it had
5 previously been handled apparently exclusively by
6 the California office?
7 A. I can only make an assumption.
8 Actually when you asked me the question regarding
9 Rels, it may not have been an assumption that the
10 account was on the credit bureau, now that I look
11 at it. It may have gone -- the phone call from
12 Rels may have gone to Associates who would have
13 directed to the California and to the Wisconsin
14 office who handles the calls with the customers.
15 Q. So if I understand correctly, if
16 Mrs. Mixon had called and complained to Associates
17 or if anyone else such as Rels Reporting had called
18 to complain to Associates, Associates would have by
19 agreement with you been required to contact the
20 Wisconsin office of Arrow?
21 A. Correct.
22 Q. But based upon the fact that this
23 person from Rels Reporting is calling, is there not
24 an indication here that there's some reporting
25 problem in connection with Mrs. Mixon's credit
39
1 reports?
2 A. Not with us necessarily, no.
3 Q. But what was done in order to
4 investigate this problem in June of 1999?
5 A. Nothing was done on our end to
6 investigate the problem.
7 Q. Did you-all have Mrs. Mixon's correct
8 telephone number on file at that time?
9 A. I don't know what Mrs. Mixon's phone
10 number is.
11 Q. I believe it's the 933 telephone
12 number, 318-933- --
13 A. 8614?
14 Q. -- 8614?
15 A. Yes. We do have that.
16 Q. So her home telephone number was on
17 file, but no one made any efforts, for example, to
18 call her on that date and discuss this with her?
19 A. It's a fraud account. If you'll notice
20 by the phone number there's an H there which means
21 hold, do not call. So the system will not allow us
22 to make a phone call.
23 Q. So the system would not allow you to
24 make collection calls to her?
25 A. Correct.
40
1 Q. Would the Wisconsin office be engaged
2 in the collection activity, or would they be in a
3 position to be able to make regular phone calls in
4 order to follow up on disputed matters?
5 A. Could you repeat the question?
6 Q. Sure. Would the Wisconsin office who
7 was contacted by Rels Reporting have the ability to
8 pick up the phone and call Mrs. Mixon and say,
9 look, we got a phone call today from Rels
10 Reporting, mortgage reporting company, apparently
11 they are still trying to help you get a mortgage.
12 We don't know what the problem is, but they called
13 us?
14 A. That would not be the procedure because
15 the account was already in dispute, told them that
16 we had it as a fraud account.
17 Q. If I understand from those notes on
18 June 14 of 1999 and again on June 21 of 1999, there
19 were additional notations indicating disputed
20 hyphen no credit bureau. Those actually mean that
21 someone went in and again posted a note to insure
22 that this was not being reported to the credit
23 bureaus?
24 A. They just left it in that disposition.
25 That disposition is the disposition that makes sure
1 Q. Was he the Arrow Representative who
2 suggested to her that she should pay the account in
3 full?
4 A. He's the supervisor, and his notes
5 indicate her name is Carol Mixon; Social Security
6 number is hers but never heard of Harmane or
7 Charmane, aside from seeing the name on other fraud
8 accounts; previous address on file is a vacant
9 building; disputing party has already followed up
10 on info.
11 Q. Would it be correct to say that
12 Mrs. Mixon had talked to Ms. DeLeon on January 11.
13 She became quite irate and asked to speak to the
14 supervisor, and then ultimately Andrew got on the
15 phone with her. And Mrs. Mixon again conveyed her
16 complaints regarding the Arrow account?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. What action did Andrew take as a result
19 of his communication with her on January 11?
20 A. Again, he left the account in the
21 disputed disposition. He had made the note that
22 she had already followed up and sent the
23 information in.
24 Q. Is it true that Mrs. Mixon faxed to
25 your company by telefax on January 5, 1999, all of
31
1 the information you-all had requested in the form
2 of a police report and a letter of dispute?
3 A. I don't have firsthand information on
4 that.
5 Q. I believe it's right here on Arrow
6 No. 1 with a fax ledger showing your fax?
7 A. Then she would have faxed it that day
8 then.
9 Q. So you-all did receive it at that time?
10 A. I can assume so, yes.
11 Q. Did Carmen Larson ever become involved
12 in this particular account?
13 A. No.
14 Q. What is Carmen's job title with Arrow?
15 A. She's clerical staff in our Wisconsin
16 office.
17 Q. Does she handle the credit reporting
18 function --
19 A. No.
20 Q. -- or any -- she's just simply a
21 clerical?
22 A. Clerical person.
23 Q. What about Marian Saylers who's
24 identified on Arrow No. 4?
25 MR. MOTLEY: Where is it, David?
32
1 MR. SZWAK: Right there. Your pen is
2 almost on top of it.
3 THE WITNESS: No. She had no contact
4 with the party. She was the actual account member
5 that was assigned to it.
6 Q. (BY MR. SZWAK:) Now the letter that
7 Mrs. Mixon sent to you-all on January 5 of 1999,
8 which I believe is Arrow Document No. 1?
9 A. Okay.
10 Q. Are you satisfied that that's a good
11 and accurate dispute by Mrs. Mixon?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. And did she also fax to you on Arrow
14 Document No. 2 and 3 a copy of the Houston police
15 report that she was able to obtain?
16 A. Yes. Those were faxed on January 12th.
17 Q. Okay. You received those documents on
18 January 12?
19 A. Correct.
20 Q. That's according to the telefax?
21 A. To the telefax.
22 Q. The letter is dated January 11?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. On your Arrow Document No. 4 there is a
25 area which is designated by 2, capital DSP,
33
1 disputed account, no CBR, can you tell me -- can
2 you decode that information for me?
3 A. She moved the account into the -- it
4 was removed from a route group from the credit
5 bureau through what we call an SM, being smart
6 disposition to DSP. So that means as soon as it
7 goes into that disposition the system creates a
8 deletion record and reported the -- change the
9 report to credit bureau from a Y to an N.
10 Q. And that was all on January 5?
11 A. That's correct.
12 Q. Let me ask you, there's an April 6 of
13 1998 notation showing it was transferred from ATM
14 to AMS. Can you decode that for me?
15 A. April?
16 Q. 6th.
17 MR. MOTLEY: Yeah, '98, right here.
18 THE WITNESS: That's just a collector
19 transfer, would have gone from one collector's unit
20 to another collector's unit.
21 Q. (BY MR. SZWAK:) What are those two
22 different units that are listed there?
23 A. I would have to look them up. I do not
24 know. They are two collectors within the company.
25 So they may have been -- the account may have
34
1 resided in one office, and then would have been
2 transferred to another office.
3 Q. From your review of that record if the
4 account were absolutely frozen as of January 5 of
5 1999, there was to be no further collection
6 activity and no further credit reportings of any
7 kind, was there any reason for there to be some
8 activity in transferring this file between
9 collectors?
10 A. It was transferred before the issue of
11 January. This was transferred April of '98.
12 Q. April of '98?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. If I understand correctly, after
15 you-all sent the first letter sometime in February
16 of '98, and it came back that no one accepted it at
17 the address, you-all stopped sending letters on
18 that account?
19 A. That's correct.
20 Q. The collector who is notated by as ED3,
21 is that Ms. DeLeon?
22 A. That is correct.
23 Q. And the collector noted as AV3, which
24 collector is that?
25 A. That's Andrew.
35
1 Q. On January 11 there was a reference to
2 the disputing party already has F/U on information,
3 what does that mean?
4 A. Follow up, that they follow up, they
5 send in the information.
6 Q. Was that an indication that Mrs. Mixon
7 had complied with your request?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. Now on June 14 of 1999, was there a
10 communication with Rels Reporting Company, another
11 mortgage reporting company?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. Can you decode that for me and tell me
14 what the substance of that communication was?
15 A. Randall from Rels Reporting Service
16 stated customer is trying to get report of CBR.
17 Rhonda stated customer -- looks like she just says
18 it was a fraud, but her name and Social Security
19 number are the same. And they have said customer
20 should be calling to get this taken care of very
21 soon.
22 Q. So Rels Reporting indicated to you
23 again that Mrs. Mixon was complaining about some
24 fraud related accounts on her report?
25 A. That's what it looks like.
36
1 Q. And did she indicate to you at that
2 time that there was an Arrow account on the report?
3 A. No information relating to that in the
4 notes. I don't know.
5 Q. Would there be any other reason for
6 Rels Reporting to be contacting you in June of 1999
7 if you had already deleted it in January of '99?
8 A. No.
9 Q. Would it be safe to assume that Rels
10 Reporting contacted you-all because your account
11 was still appearing on Mrs. Mixon's credit report?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. There's an indication down here that
14 Rels Reporting indicated to Arrow that the
15 customer, Mrs. Mixon, should have been calling to
16 get this taken care of very soon; is that correct?
17 A. That is correct.
18 Q. But according to your own records,
19 Mrs. Mixon had already been in contact with you
20 with regard to this matter, correct?
21 A. That is correct.
22 Q. What was done on June 14 of 1999 in
23 order to look into this phone call from Rels
24 Reporting?
25 A. File was left in the dispute history.
37
1 Q. If Arrow was put on notice in June of
2 1999 that their account was still being reported,
3 and Rels Reporting contacted them in order to
4 discuss Mrs. Mixon's dispute; and you had in your
5 fingertips notes indicating that you believe that
6 you had previously deleted it through tape
7 reporting, was there any process in order to follow
8 up on this and find out why this is still appearing
9 on this lady's credit report?
10 A. I would have to look up who handled
11 that. WA2 handled it. I have no idea who that
12 would be.
13 Q. In your disclosure, do we have the
14 identity of the person who is WA2? Do you know who
15 that is in the company structure?
16 A. No, not without looking it up.
17 Q. I would assume that the designator
18 three means the California office?
19 A. Correct.
20 Q. Is that correct?
21 A. That's correct.
22 Q. Which means the number two designator
23 must mean some other office of Arrow, true?
24 A. Wisconsin.
25 Q. Would that be the Illinois office,
38
1 New York office, Wisconsin office?
2 A. Wisconsin.
3 Q. Now why would the Wisconsin office be
4 working on this particular file if it had
5 previously been handled apparently exclusively by
6 the California office?
7 A. I can only make an assumption.
8 Actually when you asked me the question regarding
9 Rels, it may not have been an assumption that the
10 account was on the credit bureau, now that I look
11 at it. It may have gone -- the phone call from
12 Rels may have gone to Associates who would have
13 directed to the California and to the Wisconsin
14 office who handles the calls with the customers.
15 Q. So if I understand correctly, if
16 Mrs. Mixon had called and complained to Associates
17 or if anyone else such as Rels Reporting had called
18 to complain to Associates, Associates would have by
19 agreement with you been required to contact the
20 Wisconsin office of Arrow?
21 A. Correct.
22 Q. But based upon the fact that this
23 person from Rels Reporting is calling, is there not
24 an indication here that there's some reporting
25 problem in connection with Mrs. Mixon's credit
39
1 reports?
2 A. Not with us necessarily, no.
3 Q. But what was done in order to
4 investigate this problem in June of 1999?
5 A. Nothing was done on our end to
6 investigate the problem.
7 Q. Did you-all have Mrs. Mixon's correct
8 telephone number on file at that time?
9 A. I don't know what Mrs. Mixon's phone
10 number is.
11 Q. I believe it's the 933 telephone
12 number, 318-933- --
13 A. 8614?
14 Q. -- 8614?
15 A. Yes. We do have that.
16 Q. So her home telephone number was on
17 file, but no one made any efforts, for example, to
18 call her on that date and discuss this with her?
19 A. It's a fraud account. If you'll notice
20 by the phone number there's an H there which means
21 hold, do not call. So the system will not allow us
22 to make a phone call.
23 Q. So the system would not allow you to
24 make collection calls to her?
25 A. Correct.
40
1 Q. Would the Wisconsin office be engaged
2 in the collection activity, or would they be in a
3 position to be able to make regular phone calls in
4 order to follow up on disputed matters?
5 A. Could you repeat the question?
6 Q. Sure. Would the Wisconsin office who
7 was contacted by Rels Reporting have the ability to
8 pick up the phone and call Mrs. Mixon and say,
9 look, we got a phone call today from Rels
10 Reporting, mortgage reporting company, apparently
11 they are still trying to help you get a mortgage.
12 We don't know what the problem is, but they called
13 us?
14 A. That would not be the procedure because
15 the account was already in dispute, told them that
16 we had it as a fraud account.
17 Q. If I understand from those notes on
18 June 14 of 1999 and again on June 21 of 1999, there
19 were additional notations indicating disputed
20 hyphen no credit bureau. Those actually mean that
21 someone went in and again posted a note to insure
22 that this was not being reported to the credit
23 bureaus?
24 A. They just left it in that disposition.
25 That disposition is the disposition that makes sure
-
David A. Szwak
- Posts: 1974
- Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 11:19 pm
Part 5
41
1 the accounts are not reported.
2 Q. Does that disposition ever fall off of
3 the report or cease to be in effect and allow the
4 reporting to continue again?
5 A. No.
6 Q. Is it a periodic review?
7 A. No, just -- it's a frozen disposition.
8 When something is in there, it stays in there.
9 Q. I'm just curious why those entries
10 would need to be made on June 14 and June 21 of
11 1999 if it was already in that status?
12 A. They would have pulled it up on that
13 date, and, let's see here, June 14th is when the
14 call came in. So they just -- that's the
15 disposition it was already in. They left it in
16 there, and that's the way they set out the date.
17 Q. Did Arrow begin reporting this fraud
18 related account in January or February of 1998?
19 A. It would have been -- let's see, the
20 system February, probably would have been reported
21 on the March tape, March of '98. Could have
22 possibly been April '98.
23 Q. Have you reviewed any of Mrs. Mixon's
24 credit reports?
25 A. No, I have not.
42
1 Q. If I were to represent to you that none
2 of the 1998 credit reports that I saw indicated
3 that account possibly until late December of '98,
4 do you know if there was some reason why the Arrow
5 account would not have been reporting until late
6 '98 or early '97 (sic)?
7 A. No, I do not.
8 Q. On January 12 of 1999, do any of your
9 records reflect that on that particular date that
10 Arrow made any reporting in connection with this
11 fraud related account?
12 A. January 12?
13 Q. Yes, sir, of 1999?
14 A. No. We did nothing on January 12.
15 Q. You-all didn't inquire into
16 Mrs. Mixon's credit report?
17 A. Not from what I see, no.
18 Q. You-all didn't report any information
19 affirmatively?
20 A. No.
21 Q. No universal data form sent?
22 A. No universal data forms.
23 Q. Did you-all ever receive any CDVs
24 ACDVs, consumer dispute verification forms?
25 A. I have no idea.
43
1 Q. I'm sorry, you said no idea?
2 A. I have no idea if we received one.
3 Q. Where would those records be kept?
4 A. We wouldn't keep them. We would have
5 filled them out and sent them back.
6 Q. And you-all did not keep a copy for
7 your own protection?
8 A. No, we do not.
9 Q. According to your records, did you-all
10 ever receive a payment from the imposter in this
11 case?
12 A. No, we did not.
13 Q. I'm going to show you a document -- let
14 me first ask you, are you generally familiar with
15 reading credit reports?
16 A. Yes, I am.
17 Q. I want to show you a document which has
18 been marked as Exhibit B in Linda Turner's
19 deposition taken in this case, and see if you could
20 review that document and tell me what that is?
21 A. It's a credit report.
22 Q. And who is the named consumer on that
23 report?
24 A. Carol Cole Mixon.
25 Q. And what address is affiliated with
44
1 her?
2 A. 14979 Keatchie Road, Keithville,
3 Louisiana.
4 Q. And what's the date of that report?
5 A. Report 9/20/1999.
6 Q. And as you review the report, I believe
7 down at the bottom there is an indication as to
8 which credit reporting agency had issued that
9 report. Can you tell me from reviewing that
10 document?
11 A. Experian.
12 Q. Is that in the same general format that
13 you're used to seeing credit reports produced to
14 subscribers?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Now on that particular report can you
17 identify an Arrow Financial Service account
18 appearing on the report?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. Now what you've told me today is is
21 that this item should not be on that report, that
22 you-all had stopped making any affirmative
23 reportings, and you-all had also sent notice to the
24 credit bureaus to retract any such reportings; is
25 that true?
45
1 A. That's true.
2 Q. And yet you agree with me that it does
3 appear on the report that you're looking at?
4 A. Yes, I do.
5 Q. In connection with this trade line, are
6 you familiar with the months reviewed category, the
7 number of cycles that a particular item is
8 reported?
9 A. Which category?
10 Q. On the Arrow account, the number of
11 months that that particular item is reported to
12 have been reported to the bureau?
13 A. I'm not familiar with that.
14 Q. If I were to represent to you that this
15 particular report indicates that there had been 32
16 cycles, 32 reportings of this account to the
17 Experian Credit Reporting Agency, would you agree
18 or disagree with that?
19 A. I would have no idea.
20 Q. Well, based upon what you've told me
21 today that Arrow stopped reporting this matter in
22 January of '99 and that they had started reporting
23 it roughly in February or March of 1998, would you
24 agree that it could not have been reported 32
25 cycles unless it had continued to be reported on
46
1 through 1999?
2 A. Correct.
3 Q. Up through September; is that true?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. Now you're familiar with a fact that a
6 complex account notation, like a charge-off is a
7 bad debt, right?
8 A. Correct.
9 Q. That's a derogatory thing on a credit
10 report, right?
11 A. That is correct.
12 Q. That's not a good thing to have?
13 A. That is correct.
14 Q. I mean, when someone's credit is marked
15 with a derogatory remark, presumably if they want
16 to use the benefits of their credit report, they
17 need to get this straightened out, right?
18 A. In most cases.
19 Q. Well, there's never any reason to have
20 bad credit, right?
21 A. Quite a few reasons to have bad credit.
22 Q. No, but, I mean, it's not a desirable
23 thing?
24 A. It is not a desirable thing, that is
25 correct.
47
1 Q. I would like to show you a -- this one
2 right here. I'd like to show you a second credit
3 report, which I'll represent to you the handwritten
4 notations on them are mine?
5 A. Okay.
6 Q. And ask you if you can identify that
7 format of a credit report?
8 A. Identify it?
9 Q. Does that appear to be an Equifax or
10 CSC credit report format?
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. And who is the consumer listed on that
13 particular report?
14 A. Carolyn Henderson Mixon.
15 Q. Carol, is it --
16 A. I'm sorry, Carol Henderson Mixon.
17 Q. And is it the same address in
18 Keithville, Louisiana?
19 A. Correct.
20 Q. What is the date of that report?
21 A. August 23rd, '99.
22 Q. Would you agree with me that on that
23 report that Equifax has represented that the Arrow
24 Financial Services account is still reported?
25 A. Correct.
48
1 Q. Does it also indicate that Arrow is
2 affirmatively still reporting that account at that
3 time?
4 A. I'm not sure what you mean by
5 affirmatively reporting.
6 Q. By the date reported?
7 A. Date reported, yes.
8 Q. So according to Equifax, and we've
9 already seen an Experian report, both of those
10 national credit reporting agencies well after
11 January of 1999 are indicating on my client's
12 credit reports that Arrow is affirmatively
13 reporting that information; is that not true?
14 A. That is correct.
15 Q. And we both agree that these accounts
16 are appearing on her credit reports?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. And from what you told me today, you
19 don't have any explanation for why they are
20 appearing there. In fact, your belief is that they
21 should not be appearing there?
22 A. That is correct.
23 Q. I believe you've already told me you're
24 not familiar with credit reporting cycles?
25 A. Correct.
49
1 MR. SZWAK: Let me just take one
2 second, and I'll be finished.
3 MR. MOTLEY: David, here is your
4 deposition notice if you want him to look at it.
5 Q. (BY MR. SZWAK:) In November of 1999 did
6 Equifax contact your company with regard to the
7 Arrow Financial account?
8 A. No.
9 Q. I want to show you a document we've
10 marked as number 2235, Mixon disclosure number
11 2235, indicating that Equifax has deleted the Arrow
12 Services Bureau with the same account number. We
13 are in agreement that's the account that we've been
14 discussing?
15 A. There it is, okay, yes.
16 Q. And from what you're telling me, you
17 don't have any records to suggest that Equifax
18 contacted you in November of 1999 when they removed
19 this item?
20 A. I have no information to that effect.
21 Q. If any of the other defendants in this
22 case, or Equifax who was a defendant in the case or
23 CSC who was a defendant in the case, indicate that
24 they had contacted Arrow Financial Services on or
25 after January 5 of 1999 and suggest that you-all
50
1 verified this account, told them to keep reporting,
2 would that be true or not true?
3 A. That they contacted our office?
4 Q. Right.
5 A. I would have no idea.
6 Q. You don't have any records to that
7 effect, do you?
8 A. Nothing at all.
9 Q. Would there be any other records that
10 would be maintained anywhere in the Arrow structure
11 that might indicate any contacts between the credit
12 reporting companies and Arrow?
13 A. Not that I'm aware of, unless
14 Lance Martin due to the fact that this was an
15 account that we were sued on would have a paper or
16 file of any sort, general counsel.
17 Q. If a credit reporting agency had
18 contacted you-all to dispute or to convey to you a
19 dispute from a consumer or from some third person
20 pertaining to this account, would those notes be
21 recorded anywhere in the collector's summary?
22 A. They should have been, yes.
23 Q. They should have been if it occurred;
24 is that true?
25 A. Yes.
1 the accounts are not reported.
2 Q. Does that disposition ever fall off of
3 the report or cease to be in effect and allow the
4 reporting to continue again?
5 A. No.
6 Q. Is it a periodic review?
7 A. No, just -- it's a frozen disposition.
8 When something is in there, it stays in there.
9 Q. I'm just curious why those entries
10 would need to be made on June 14 and June 21 of
11 1999 if it was already in that status?
12 A. They would have pulled it up on that
13 date, and, let's see here, June 14th is when the
14 call came in. So they just -- that's the
15 disposition it was already in. They left it in
16 there, and that's the way they set out the date.
17 Q. Did Arrow begin reporting this fraud
18 related account in January or February of 1998?
19 A. It would have been -- let's see, the
20 system February, probably would have been reported
21 on the March tape, March of '98. Could have
22 possibly been April '98.
23 Q. Have you reviewed any of Mrs. Mixon's
24 credit reports?
25 A. No, I have not.
42
1 Q. If I were to represent to you that none
2 of the 1998 credit reports that I saw indicated
3 that account possibly until late December of '98,
4 do you know if there was some reason why the Arrow
5 account would not have been reporting until late
6 '98 or early '97 (sic)?
7 A. No, I do not.
8 Q. On January 12 of 1999, do any of your
9 records reflect that on that particular date that
10 Arrow made any reporting in connection with this
11 fraud related account?
12 A. January 12?
13 Q. Yes, sir, of 1999?
14 A. No. We did nothing on January 12.
15 Q. You-all didn't inquire into
16 Mrs. Mixon's credit report?
17 A. Not from what I see, no.
18 Q. You-all didn't report any information
19 affirmatively?
20 A. No.
21 Q. No universal data form sent?
22 A. No universal data forms.
23 Q. Did you-all ever receive any CDVs
24 ACDVs, consumer dispute verification forms?
25 A. I have no idea.
43
1 Q. I'm sorry, you said no idea?
2 A. I have no idea if we received one.
3 Q. Where would those records be kept?
4 A. We wouldn't keep them. We would have
5 filled them out and sent them back.
6 Q. And you-all did not keep a copy for
7 your own protection?
8 A. No, we do not.
9 Q. According to your records, did you-all
10 ever receive a payment from the imposter in this
11 case?
12 A. No, we did not.
13 Q. I'm going to show you a document -- let
14 me first ask you, are you generally familiar with
15 reading credit reports?
16 A. Yes, I am.
17 Q. I want to show you a document which has
18 been marked as Exhibit B in Linda Turner's
19 deposition taken in this case, and see if you could
20 review that document and tell me what that is?
21 A. It's a credit report.
22 Q. And who is the named consumer on that
23 report?
24 A. Carol Cole Mixon.
25 Q. And what address is affiliated with
44
1 her?
2 A. 14979 Keatchie Road, Keithville,
3 Louisiana.
4 Q. And what's the date of that report?
5 A. Report 9/20/1999.
6 Q. And as you review the report, I believe
7 down at the bottom there is an indication as to
8 which credit reporting agency had issued that
9 report. Can you tell me from reviewing that
10 document?
11 A. Experian.
12 Q. Is that in the same general format that
13 you're used to seeing credit reports produced to
14 subscribers?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Now on that particular report can you
17 identify an Arrow Financial Service account
18 appearing on the report?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. Now what you've told me today is is
21 that this item should not be on that report, that
22 you-all had stopped making any affirmative
23 reportings, and you-all had also sent notice to the
24 credit bureaus to retract any such reportings; is
25 that true?
45
1 A. That's true.
2 Q. And yet you agree with me that it does
3 appear on the report that you're looking at?
4 A. Yes, I do.
5 Q. In connection with this trade line, are
6 you familiar with the months reviewed category, the
7 number of cycles that a particular item is
8 reported?
9 A. Which category?
10 Q. On the Arrow account, the number of
11 months that that particular item is reported to
12 have been reported to the bureau?
13 A. I'm not familiar with that.
14 Q. If I were to represent to you that this
15 particular report indicates that there had been 32
16 cycles, 32 reportings of this account to the
17 Experian Credit Reporting Agency, would you agree
18 or disagree with that?
19 A. I would have no idea.
20 Q. Well, based upon what you've told me
21 today that Arrow stopped reporting this matter in
22 January of '99 and that they had started reporting
23 it roughly in February or March of 1998, would you
24 agree that it could not have been reported 32
25 cycles unless it had continued to be reported on
46
1 through 1999?
2 A. Correct.
3 Q. Up through September; is that true?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. Now you're familiar with a fact that a
6 complex account notation, like a charge-off is a
7 bad debt, right?
8 A. Correct.
9 Q. That's a derogatory thing on a credit
10 report, right?
11 A. That is correct.
12 Q. That's not a good thing to have?
13 A. That is correct.
14 Q. I mean, when someone's credit is marked
15 with a derogatory remark, presumably if they want
16 to use the benefits of their credit report, they
17 need to get this straightened out, right?
18 A. In most cases.
19 Q. Well, there's never any reason to have
20 bad credit, right?
21 A. Quite a few reasons to have bad credit.
22 Q. No, but, I mean, it's not a desirable
23 thing?
24 A. It is not a desirable thing, that is
25 correct.
47
1 Q. I would like to show you a -- this one
2 right here. I'd like to show you a second credit
3 report, which I'll represent to you the handwritten
4 notations on them are mine?
5 A. Okay.
6 Q. And ask you if you can identify that
7 format of a credit report?
8 A. Identify it?
9 Q. Does that appear to be an Equifax or
10 CSC credit report format?
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. And who is the consumer listed on that
13 particular report?
14 A. Carolyn Henderson Mixon.
15 Q. Carol, is it --
16 A. I'm sorry, Carol Henderson Mixon.
17 Q. And is it the same address in
18 Keithville, Louisiana?
19 A. Correct.
20 Q. What is the date of that report?
21 A. August 23rd, '99.
22 Q. Would you agree with me that on that
23 report that Equifax has represented that the Arrow
24 Financial Services account is still reported?
25 A. Correct.
48
1 Q. Does it also indicate that Arrow is
2 affirmatively still reporting that account at that
3 time?
4 A. I'm not sure what you mean by
5 affirmatively reporting.
6 Q. By the date reported?
7 A. Date reported, yes.
8 Q. So according to Equifax, and we've
9 already seen an Experian report, both of those
10 national credit reporting agencies well after
11 January of 1999 are indicating on my client's
12 credit reports that Arrow is affirmatively
13 reporting that information; is that not true?
14 A. That is correct.
15 Q. And we both agree that these accounts
16 are appearing on her credit reports?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. And from what you told me today, you
19 don't have any explanation for why they are
20 appearing there. In fact, your belief is that they
21 should not be appearing there?
22 A. That is correct.
23 Q. I believe you've already told me you're
24 not familiar with credit reporting cycles?
25 A. Correct.
49
1 MR. SZWAK: Let me just take one
2 second, and I'll be finished.
3 MR. MOTLEY: David, here is your
4 deposition notice if you want him to look at it.
5 Q. (BY MR. SZWAK:) In November of 1999 did
6 Equifax contact your company with regard to the
7 Arrow Financial account?
8 A. No.
9 Q. I want to show you a document we've
10 marked as number 2235, Mixon disclosure number
11 2235, indicating that Equifax has deleted the Arrow
12 Services Bureau with the same account number. We
13 are in agreement that's the account that we've been
14 discussing?
15 A. There it is, okay, yes.
16 Q. And from what you're telling me, you
17 don't have any records to suggest that Equifax
18 contacted you in November of 1999 when they removed
19 this item?
20 A. I have no information to that effect.
21 Q. If any of the other defendants in this
22 case, or Equifax who was a defendant in the case or
23 CSC who was a defendant in the case, indicate that
24 they had contacted Arrow Financial Services on or
25 after January 5 of 1999 and suggest that you-all
50
1 verified this account, told them to keep reporting,
2 would that be true or not true?
3 A. That they contacted our office?
4 Q. Right.
5 A. I would have no idea.
6 Q. You don't have any records to that
7 effect, do you?
8 A. Nothing at all.
9 Q. Would there be any other records that
10 would be maintained anywhere in the Arrow structure
11 that might indicate any contacts between the credit
12 reporting companies and Arrow?
13 A. Not that I'm aware of, unless
14 Lance Martin due to the fact that this was an
15 account that we were sued on would have a paper or
16 file of any sort, general counsel.
17 Q. If a credit reporting agency had
18 contacted you-all to dispute or to convey to you a
19 dispute from a consumer or from some third person
20 pertaining to this account, would those notes be
21 recorded anywhere in the collector's summary?
22 A. They should have been, yes.
23 Q. They should have been if it occurred;
24 is that true?
25 A. Yes.
-
David A. Szwak
- Posts: 1974
- Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 11:19 pm
Part 6
51
1 Q. To your knowledge, that's a full and
2 complete set of all the notes that were made
3 pertaining to this account?
4 A. Up to July 5th, 1999.
5 MR. SZWAK: I'll tender the witness.
6 MR. DOGGETT: We'll reserve our
7 questions.
8 MR. DUNNILL: We'll reserve our
9 questions.
10 MS. JARED: Can we take a quick break?
11 MR. SZWAK: Sure.
12 (RECESS)
13 EXAMINATION
14 BY MR. McLOON:
15 Q. Good afternoon, Mr. Cutler. I'm
16 Dan McLoon with Jones, Day. We represent
17 Experian. Would it be correct that you did not
18 have any personal involvement in any of the
19 communications that occurred between your company
20 and the plaintiff in this case in January of 1999?
21 A. That is correct.
22 Q. So your knowledge of what occurred in
23 January of 1999, is that based only upon your
24 review of the notes, the computer entry notes that
25 you had in front of you earlier?
52
1 A. That is correct.
2 Q. Did you do anything before coming here
3 today to find out whether or not those notes were
4 accurate? Did you talk to the people who were
5 indicated on the report as being the ones who made
6 the notes?
7 A. No, I did not.
8 Q. Did you do anything else to find out
9 whether or not items that were indicated as having
10 been done actually occurred, other than just
11 looking at the notes in front of you?
12 A. No, I did not.
13 Q. Now I want to understand the process by
14 which the status of this account goes from being an
15 account that's under active collection or at least
16 subject to collection into this disputed status
17 that you talked about. If a collector types a note
18 on the computer that produces the kind of entry
19 that you were looking at, does the mere act of
20 typing the note cause the computer to recognize
21 that this is a fraud account, and it needs to be
22 put into the disputed status?
23 A. No.
24 Q. What else has to be done by the
25 collector to cause the status to change from one
53
1 that can be collected into a disputed account other
2 than typing notes?
3 A. Collector actually goes into -- it's a
4 window environment, and they go into window one of
5 this computer system. And that's where they enter
6 that 2 DSP, and that also gets -- that's a double
7 entry. The system does automatically enter that
8 into the notes themselves. So the 2 DSP
9 information that's entered there on the system was
10 done via the computer.
11 Q. And which entry is that? What was the
12 date on it, January?
13 A. January 5th, 1999.
14 Q. It's a line item that looks like it has
15 a 3:06 p.m. time?
16 A. Correct. And that would be Pacific
17 time.
18 Q. And your testimony is that that entry
19 was not manually typed by a collector; is that
20 right?
21 A. Yes and no. The one you're looking at
22 was not. If you'll look at the top here,
23 disposition, they go -- that's considered window
24 one. They go in there. They put in 2 DSP. That's
25 the only entry they put in. The system
54
1 automatically creates the explanation what 2 DSP
2 is, which is disputed account, no credit bureau.
3 And the system notes would be the three line items
4 above where it does the credit report, where it
5 changes the credit reporting flag. The system does
6 that automatically, and it also does the remove
7 route group from credit report.
8 Q. Now, the document that we're looking at
9 in the upper left-hand corner has a date of
10 7/21/99, what does that date reflect?
11 A. That would have been the date we
12 printed those notes.
13 Q. Now, based upon your knowledge of the
14 system, is it ever possible that an entry bearing
15 the date of 1/5/99 could have occurred at a date
16 other than 1/5/99?
17 A. No, it is not possible.
18 Q. And what documentation -- if I was to
19 hire, as I will, a computer expert to review your
20 system, what documentation is available to show
21 that these are entries that were made automatically
22 as opposed to manual?
23 A. I would have to demonstrate it to you.
24 I can put it on a dummy account and do it and show
25 you.
55
1 Q. Do you have any code? Do you have
2 records of the code of the software that runs --
3 A. No. We purchased that software. So we
4 don't have the source code.
5 Q. So you did not design this software?
6 Someone else did?
7 A. Correct.
8 Q. Do you know who that was?
9 A. Yeah, Ontario Systems.
10 Q. Where are they located?
11 A. Muncie, Indiana.
12 Q. Do you have any instruction manuals or
13 operating manuals that would explain this?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. Can you describe those?
16 A. I mean, there's maybe 10 or 20 volumes
17 of books that tell you how the system works.
18 Q. If I was going to request it, how would
19 I describe those books?
20 A. You would want the -- let's see, I'm
21 not sure what they are called. You would want the
22 system documentation, I guess, just user
23 documentation.
24 Q. So if we were to ask you to get all the
25 system or user documentation, you would know to go
56
1 for those 20 volumes or whatever?
2 A. Correct.
3 Q. Now, the tapes that are sent to the
4 credit reporting agencies, what's the process by
5 which those tapes are prepared? Does someone have
6 to physically go in and press a button in the
7 computer to create the tape?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. And who does that?
10 A. One of my IS people.
11 Q. So that's not something you personally
12 did in this case?
13 A. No, I did not.
14 Q. What records do you keep of the
15 preparation of tapes that are sent to credit
16 reporting agencies?
17 A. What do you mean by what records?
18 Q. Well, you talked about monthly tapes,
19 do you keep some log that says tape number so and
20 so was sent on a particular date?
21 A. No. We send out the tapes. We create
22 a file, a tape file, and that gets written on the
23 tape. And then that gets sent out to the different
24 bureaus.
25 Q. I understand the process. What I'm
57
1 trying to find out is are there any documents that
2 would record that process?
3 A. No, there are not.
4 Q. Do you keep mailing receipts that would
5 show when they were sent by Federal Express or
6 whatever?
7 A. I would have to check if we have
8 anything like that.
9 Q. And who designed the software that
10 generates the tape containing the credit
11 information and the right format for the credit
12 reporting agencies?
13 A. Ontario Systems.
14 Q. And if a credit reporting agency
15 received a tape that had data on it that could not
16 be read, and they contacted your company about a
17 tape that they received saying there was some
18 problem in reading the data, who would they contact
19 at your company?
20 A. They would probably contact me.
21 Q. And do you keep records of contacts
22 from credit reporting agencies concerning problems
23 with your tape?
24 A. We haven't had any problems with
25 reading tapes.
58
1 Q. So to your knowledge no one has ever
2 contacted you with a problem on your tape?
3 A. Right.
4 Q. Now you said that changing the flag
5 from yes on credit reporting to no on credit
6 reporting is done automatically by the computer?
7 A. Correct.
8 Q. And what is the mechanism that causes
9 then some signal to be added to the tape that's
10 sent to a credit reporting agency? How does that
11 occur?
12 A. It sets up a flag in the system to
13 create a deletion file disposition.
14 Q. Is this in the system documentation,
15 user documentation that you referred to a few
16 moments ago?
17 A. I haven't read it. We've been on the
18 system for 12 years. So I have not read the
19 documentation to be honest with you.
20 Q. But this is again still the Ontario
21 Systems software?
22 A. Correct.
23 Q. Again, there's no secret here, as
24 counsel for the plaintiffs was trying to point out,
25 this account continued to be reported apparently by
59
1 more than one credit reporting agency. Since the
2 process of reading tapes is an automated process,
3 it's not human beings involved looking at each
4 account deciding whether or not they are going to
5 delete it or not, it's sort of perplexing to figure
6 out how it could be that if you sent a tape signal
7 or some sort of a message on the tape to the credit
8 reporting agencies to delete it, that it didn't
9 occur, because it should happen automatically?
10 A. That's correct.
11 Q. Are you aware of any other instances in
12 which you were under the impression that you had
13 sent this delete message to the credit reporting
14 agency, and a deletion did not occur?
15 A. No, I am not.
16 Q. I understand at least from experience
17 point of view the practice is to return the tapes
18 to you after they've read the data?
19 A. That is correct.
20 Q. Do you keep those tapes?
21 A. We recycle them.
22 Q. I assume you have some sort of library
23 of tapes?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. Is there any way to figure out whether
60
1 or not you still have on hand any particular tape
2 that's --
3 A. We rewrite over those tapes.
4 Q. Well, I understand the practice is that
5 you rewrite over the tapes, but if you have a bunch
6 of library of tapes, you may or may not pull a
7 particular tape off the shelf to use. I'm just
8 asking is there any record to keep track of what
9 tapes have been returned or whether they've been
10 written over?
11 A. No.
12 Q. The CDVs that you receive from credit
13 reporting agencies, are they manual or automated?
14 A. Manual.
15 Q. Do you have a contact at Ontario
16 systems who is like an account rep or something?
17 A. John Young.
18 Q. And as far as you know he's in the
19 Muncie office?
20 A. Yes, he is. Would you like his
21 number?
22 Q. Sure.
23 A. 765-751-7100.
24 Q. The universal data form that was
25 prepared, at least has the date of October 13,
61
1 1999, did you prepare that document?
2 A. No I did not.
3 Q. Do you know who did?
4 A. Ramona Peyton.
5 Q. How do you tell that, is that just by
6 the name?
7 A. She signed it.
8 Q. And you didn't request this? You
9 didn't have any personal involvement in it?
10 A. Yes, I did. I did request it. I asked
11 her to fill it out for me and make sure all the
12 bureaus got it.
13 Q. And can you tell me what occurred that
14 caused you to make that request?
15 A. I'm sorry?
16 Q. What occurred that caused you to make
17 that request?
18 A. Mr. Motley called me and said the
19 information was still on the bureau.
20 MR. MOTLEY: Don't disclose anything
21 else that we've discussed.
22 Q. (BY MR. McLOON:) And is there a normal
23 practice of how these universal data forms are
24 processed to the credit reporting agencies?
25 A. Is there a --
62
1 Q. Normal practice?
2 A. No. We just -- if we have a verified
3 dispute, then we'll ask it to be deleted.
4 Q. But after this paper, piece of paper --
5 this is a piece of paper, right?
6 A. Right.
7 Q. It's not transmitted through the
8 computer lines?
9 A. No. It's mailed out.
10 Q. Sent by mail?
11 A. Correct.
12 Q. And so if you're sending it to more
13 than one credit reporting agency, multiple copies
14 have to be prepared?
15 A. Correct.
16 Q. Is it the practice to prepare multiple
17 originals, or do you just photocopy the same form?
18 A. Photocopy the same form.
19 Q. And is there a record made of the
20 mailing?
21 A. No, there is not.
22 Q. Did you do any follow-up to find out
23 whether in this particular case this form was
24 actually mailed out?
25 A. I verified that it was mailed out.
1 Q. To your knowledge, that's a full and
2 complete set of all the notes that were made
3 pertaining to this account?
4 A. Up to July 5th, 1999.
5 MR. SZWAK: I'll tender the witness.
6 MR. DOGGETT: We'll reserve our
7 questions.
8 MR. DUNNILL: We'll reserve our
9 questions.
10 MS. JARED: Can we take a quick break?
11 MR. SZWAK: Sure.
12 (RECESS)
13 EXAMINATION
14 BY MR. McLOON:
15 Q. Good afternoon, Mr. Cutler. I'm
16 Dan McLoon with Jones, Day. We represent
17 Experian. Would it be correct that you did not
18 have any personal involvement in any of the
19 communications that occurred between your company
20 and the plaintiff in this case in January of 1999?
21 A. That is correct.
22 Q. So your knowledge of what occurred in
23 January of 1999, is that based only upon your
24 review of the notes, the computer entry notes that
25 you had in front of you earlier?
52
1 A. That is correct.
2 Q. Did you do anything before coming here
3 today to find out whether or not those notes were
4 accurate? Did you talk to the people who were
5 indicated on the report as being the ones who made
6 the notes?
7 A. No, I did not.
8 Q. Did you do anything else to find out
9 whether or not items that were indicated as having
10 been done actually occurred, other than just
11 looking at the notes in front of you?
12 A. No, I did not.
13 Q. Now I want to understand the process by
14 which the status of this account goes from being an
15 account that's under active collection or at least
16 subject to collection into this disputed status
17 that you talked about. If a collector types a note
18 on the computer that produces the kind of entry
19 that you were looking at, does the mere act of
20 typing the note cause the computer to recognize
21 that this is a fraud account, and it needs to be
22 put into the disputed status?
23 A. No.
24 Q. What else has to be done by the
25 collector to cause the status to change from one
53
1 that can be collected into a disputed account other
2 than typing notes?
3 A. Collector actually goes into -- it's a
4 window environment, and they go into window one of
5 this computer system. And that's where they enter
6 that 2 DSP, and that also gets -- that's a double
7 entry. The system does automatically enter that
8 into the notes themselves. So the 2 DSP
9 information that's entered there on the system was
10 done via the computer.
11 Q. And which entry is that? What was the
12 date on it, January?
13 A. January 5th, 1999.
14 Q. It's a line item that looks like it has
15 a 3:06 p.m. time?
16 A. Correct. And that would be Pacific
17 time.
18 Q. And your testimony is that that entry
19 was not manually typed by a collector; is that
20 right?
21 A. Yes and no. The one you're looking at
22 was not. If you'll look at the top here,
23 disposition, they go -- that's considered window
24 one. They go in there. They put in 2 DSP. That's
25 the only entry they put in. The system
54
1 automatically creates the explanation what 2 DSP
2 is, which is disputed account, no credit bureau.
3 And the system notes would be the three line items
4 above where it does the credit report, where it
5 changes the credit reporting flag. The system does
6 that automatically, and it also does the remove
7 route group from credit report.
8 Q. Now, the document that we're looking at
9 in the upper left-hand corner has a date of
10 7/21/99, what does that date reflect?
11 A. That would have been the date we
12 printed those notes.
13 Q. Now, based upon your knowledge of the
14 system, is it ever possible that an entry bearing
15 the date of 1/5/99 could have occurred at a date
16 other than 1/5/99?
17 A. No, it is not possible.
18 Q. And what documentation -- if I was to
19 hire, as I will, a computer expert to review your
20 system, what documentation is available to show
21 that these are entries that were made automatically
22 as opposed to manual?
23 A. I would have to demonstrate it to you.
24 I can put it on a dummy account and do it and show
25 you.
55
1 Q. Do you have any code? Do you have
2 records of the code of the software that runs --
3 A. No. We purchased that software. So we
4 don't have the source code.
5 Q. So you did not design this software?
6 Someone else did?
7 A. Correct.
8 Q. Do you know who that was?
9 A. Yeah, Ontario Systems.
10 Q. Where are they located?
11 A. Muncie, Indiana.
12 Q. Do you have any instruction manuals or
13 operating manuals that would explain this?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. Can you describe those?
16 A. I mean, there's maybe 10 or 20 volumes
17 of books that tell you how the system works.
18 Q. If I was going to request it, how would
19 I describe those books?
20 A. You would want the -- let's see, I'm
21 not sure what they are called. You would want the
22 system documentation, I guess, just user
23 documentation.
24 Q. So if we were to ask you to get all the
25 system or user documentation, you would know to go
56
1 for those 20 volumes or whatever?
2 A. Correct.
3 Q. Now, the tapes that are sent to the
4 credit reporting agencies, what's the process by
5 which those tapes are prepared? Does someone have
6 to physically go in and press a button in the
7 computer to create the tape?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. And who does that?
10 A. One of my IS people.
11 Q. So that's not something you personally
12 did in this case?
13 A. No, I did not.
14 Q. What records do you keep of the
15 preparation of tapes that are sent to credit
16 reporting agencies?
17 A. What do you mean by what records?
18 Q. Well, you talked about monthly tapes,
19 do you keep some log that says tape number so and
20 so was sent on a particular date?
21 A. No. We send out the tapes. We create
22 a file, a tape file, and that gets written on the
23 tape. And then that gets sent out to the different
24 bureaus.
25 Q. I understand the process. What I'm
57
1 trying to find out is are there any documents that
2 would record that process?
3 A. No, there are not.
4 Q. Do you keep mailing receipts that would
5 show when they were sent by Federal Express or
6 whatever?
7 A. I would have to check if we have
8 anything like that.
9 Q. And who designed the software that
10 generates the tape containing the credit
11 information and the right format for the credit
12 reporting agencies?
13 A. Ontario Systems.
14 Q. And if a credit reporting agency
15 received a tape that had data on it that could not
16 be read, and they contacted your company about a
17 tape that they received saying there was some
18 problem in reading the data, who would they contact
19 at your company?
20 A. They would probably contact me.
21 Q. And do you keep records of contacts
22 from credit reporting agencies concerning problems
23 with your tape?
24 A. We haven't had any problems with
25 reading tapes.
58
1 Q. So to your knowledge no one has ever
2 contacted you with a problem on your tape?
3 A. Right.
4 Q. Now you said that changing the flag
5 from yes on credit reporting to no on credit
6 reporting is done automatically by the computer?
7 A. Correct.
8 Q. And what is the mechanism that causes
9 then some signal to be added to the tape that's
10 sent to a credit reporting agency? How does that
11 occur?
12 A. It sets up a flag in the system to
13 create a deletion file disposition.
14 Q. Is this in the system documentation,
15 user documentation that you referred to a few
16 moments ago?
17 A. I haven't read it. We've been on the
18 system for 12 years. So I have not read the
19 documentation to be honest with you.
20 Q. But this is again still the Ontario
21 Systems software?
22 A. Correct.
23 Q. Again, there's no secret here, as
24 counsel for the plaintiffs was trying to point out,
25 this account continued to be reported apparently by
59
1 more than one credit reporting agency. Since the
2 process of reading tapes is an automated process,
3 it's not human beings involved looking at each
4 account deciding whether or not they are going to
5 delete it or not, it's sort of perplexing to figure
6 out how it could be that if you sent a tape signal
7 or some sort of a message on the tape to the credit
8 reporting agencies to delete it, that it didn't
9 occur, because it should happen automatically?
10 A. That's correct.
11 Q. Are you aware of any other instances in
12 which you were under the impression that you had
13 sent this delete message to the credit reporting
14 agency, and a deletion did not occur?
15 A. No, I am not.
16 Q. I understand at least from experience
17 point of view the practice is to return the tapes
18 to you after they've read the data?
19 A. That is correct.
20 Q. Do you keep those tapes?
21 A. We recycle them.
22 Q. I assume you have some sort of library
23 of tapes?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. Is there any way to figure out whether
60
1 or not you still have on hand any particular tape
2 that's --
3 A. We rewrite over those tapes.
4 Q. Well, I understand the practice is that
5 you rewrite over the tapes, but if you have a bunch
6 of library of tapes, you may or may not pull a
7 particular tape off the shelf to use. I'm just
8 asking is there any record to keep track of what
9 tapes have been returned or whether they've been
10 written over?
11 A. No.
12 Q. The CDVs that you receive from credit
13 reporting agencies, are they manual or automated?
14 A. Manual.
15 Q. Do you have a contact at Ontario
16 systems who is like an account rep or something?
17 A. John Young.
18 Q. And as far as you know he's in the
19 Muncie office?
20 A. Yes, he is. Would you like his
21 number?
22 Q. Sure.
23 A. 765-751-7100.
24 Q. The universal data form that was
25 prepared, at least has the date of October 13,
61
1 1999, did you prepare that document?
2 A. No I did not.
3 Q. Do you know who did?
4 A. Ramona Peyton.
5 Q. How do you tell that, is that just by
6 the name?
7 A. She signed it.
8 Q. And you didn't request this? You
9 didn't have any personal involvement in it?
10 A. Yes, I did. I did request it. I asked
11 her to fill it out for me and make sure all the
12 bureaus got it.
13 Q. And can you tell me what occurred that
14 caused you to make that request?
15 A. I'm sorry?
16 Q. What occurred that caused you to make
17 that request?
18 A. Mr. Motley called me and said the
19 information was still on the bureau.
20 MR. MOTLEY: Don't disclose anything
21 else that we've discussed.
22 Q. (BY MR. McLOON:) And is there a normal
23 practice of how these universal data forms are
24 processed to the credit reporting agencies?
25 A. Is there a --
62
1 Q. Normal practice?
2 A. No. We just -- if we have a verified
3 dispute, then we'll ask it to be deleted.
4 Q. But after this paper, piece of paper --
5 this is a piece of paper, right?
6 A. Right.
7 Q. It's not transmitted through the
8 computer lines?
9 A. No. It's mailed out.
10 Q. Sent by mail?
11 A. Correct.
12 Q. And so if you're sending it to more
13 than one credit reporting agency, multiple copies
14 have to be prepared?
15 A. Correct.
16 Q. Is it the practice to prepare multiple
17 originals, or do you just photocopy the same form?
18 A. Photocopy the same form.
19 Q. And is there a record made of the
20 mailing?
21 A. No, there is not.
22 Q. Did you do any follow-up to find out
23 whether in this particular case this form was
24 actually mailed out?
25 A. I verified that it was mailed out.
-
David A. Szwak
- Posts: 1974
- Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 11:19 pm
Part 7
63
1 Q. How did you do that?
2 A. I spoke to Ms. Peyton.
3 Q. And she told you she had done it?
4 A. She had taken care of it.
5 Q. Did you ever check the accuracy of the
6 information on this form?
7 A. I saw the form, yes.
8 Q. My question was did you check the
9 accuracy of the information?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. How did you do that? What did you do
12 to check?
13 A. Well, I needed to check. My main
14 concern was just one thing, we marked down there to
15 delete it. That's the only thing I checked.
16 Q. So you didn't check the subscriber
17 codes?
18 A. No, I did not.
19 Q. And where is it mailed if it's going to
20 be mailed to Experian?
21 A. I do not know.
22 Q. How many of these universal data forms,
23 manual ones, do you prepare in an ordinary month?
24 A. I do not know.
25 Q. Who would know?
64
1 A. You have to talk to our clerical people
2 that handle it. We have one person that usually
3 handles those.
4 Q. Is that part of your normal routine
5 duties to prepare these documents?
6 A. Mine personally?
7 Q. Right.
8 A. No, it is not.
9 Q. And are they mailed with any sort of
10 return receipt being requested so that you have an
11 evidence that it's actually been received?
12 A. No, they are not.
13 Q. Is there any follow-up done after they
14 are mailed to find out whether they've been
15 received and acted upon?
16 A. No, we do not.
17 Q. And who are the people within your
18 company who receive and respond to CVDs?
19 A. I do not know.
20 Q. Is there a supervisor or a management
21 person who would be responsible for that?
22 A. Chuck Sprague.
23 Q. And he's in Wisconsin?
24 A. No. He's in Chicago. He's in charge
25 of the clerical staff.
65
1 Q. And did you speak with him about this
2 case before coming here to testify?
3 A. No, I did not.
4 Q. Did you do anything to find out what
5 had occurred with respect to CVDs that might be
6 relevant to this case?
7 A. No, I did not.
8 Q. When this Ramona Peyton prepared this
9 universal data form, did you give her any
10 documentation that she should use to prepare it?
11 A. No, I did not.
12 Q. What instructions, as best you can
13 recall, did you give her?
14 A. Gave her the account number, and I said
15 prepare the form and make sure it gets deleted.
16 Q. Do you have the form in front of you?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. Do you have any personal information as
19 to where this Ms. Peyton would have got, for
20 example, the address, the current address that was
21 written down?
22 A. Can only assume from the computer
23 system.
24 Q. But you don't know?
25 A. Don't know for a fact.
66
1 Q. Can you look at any other documents to
2 indicate whether that's the address that your
3 company was showing in relationship to this account
4 when this document was prepared?
5 A. Yes. That is the address that was in
6 our computer system.
7 Q. And you know that by looking where?
8 A. Looking in window -- what we call
9 window two.
10 Q. This is from the same notes?
11 A. The notes.
12 Q. How about the first date of
13 delinquency?
14 A. She would have used that charge -- the
15 service date. It's also in those notes, in the
16 middle, service date.
17 Q. And the phrase service date is not -- I
18 mean, I do hundreds of credit reporting cases.
19 It's not one that I recognize as being a term. Can
20 you explain what service date is?
21 A. That is what we use as the -- that's
22 the new first date of delinquency that we pick up
23 from the consumer that we have to do on the tape
24 reporting.
25 Q. And where do you get that date from?
67
1 A. From the client, Associates.
2 Q. And in what form does that come to
3 you? Is that in sort of a hard file, or is it on a
4 tape?
5 A. Tape.
6 Q. Is there any other way that that date
7 of service could appear as 1/1/97, other than on a
8 tape received from Associates?
9 A. No.
10 MR. McLOON: That's all I have.
11 MR. MOTLEY: We'll reserve ours.
12 MR. SZWAK: Reading and signing?
13 MR. MOTLEY: If you will send it to me,
14 then I will take care of it.
15
16 (DEPOSITION CONCLUDED)
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
68
1 CHANGES AND SIGNATURE
2
3 PAGE LINE CHANGE REASON
4 _____ _____ __________________________________
5 _____ _____ __________________________________
6 _____ _____ __________________________________
7 _____ _____ __________________________________
8 _____ _____ __________________________________
9 _____ _____ __________________________________
10 _____ _____ __________________________________
11 _____ _____ __________________________________
12 _____ _____ __________________________________
13 _____ _____ __________________________________
14 _____ _____ __________________________________
15 _____ _____ __________________________________
16 _____ _____ __________________________________
17 _____ _____ __________________________________
18 _____ _____ __________________________________
19 _____ _____ __________________________________
20 _____ _____ __________________________________
21 _____ _____ __________________________________
22
23
24 I, BRIAN CUTLER, have read the
25 foregoing deposition and hereby affix my signature
69
1 that same is true and correct, except as noted
2 above.
3 __________________________
4 BRIAN CUTLER
5
6
7 THE STATE OF ________________ )
8
9 COUNTY OF ___________________ )
10
11 Before me, ______________________, on
12 this day personally appeared, BRIAN CUTLER, known
13 to me (or proved to me under oath or through
14 ____________) to be the person whose name is
15 subscribed to the foregoing instrument and
16 acknowledged to me that they executed the same for
17 the purposes and consideration therein expressed.
18
19 Given under my hand and seal of office
20 this ______ day of ___________, 1999.
21
22 __________________________
23 NOTARY PUBLIC IN AND FOR
24 THE STATE OF ___________
25
70
1 STATE OF LOUISIANA)
2 PARISH OF CADDO )
3 I, MELANIE C. HARRIS, do hereby
4 certify that, pursuant to the agreement hereinabove
5 set forth, there came before me at the time and
6 place set forth herein, the following named person,
7 to-wit: BRIAN CUTLER, who was by me duly sworn to
8 testify to the truth of witness' knowledge
9 concerning the matters in controversy in this
10 cause; that such witness was thereupon examined
11 under oath, and the examination transcribed by
12 computer-assisted transcription by me, and that the
13 deposition is a true record of the testimony given
14 by the witness.
15 I further certify that I am neither
16 attorney nor counsel for, nor related to or
17 employed by, any of the parties to the action in
18 which this deposition is taken and, further, that I
19 am not a relative or employee of any attorney or
20 counsel employed by the parties hereto, or
21 financially interested in the action.
22 SUBSCRIBED AND SWORN TO on this the
________ day of ___________________, A.D. 1999.
23
________________________________
24 Melanie C. Harris, CSR, CCR, RPR
Hanrahan Reporting Service, LLC
25 2800 Youree Drive, Suite C-330
Shreveport, Louisiana 71105
1 Q. How did you do that?
2 A. I spoke to Ms. Peyton.
3 Q. And she told you she had done it?
4 A. She had taken care of it.
5 Q. Did you ever check the accuracy of the
6 information on this form?
7 A. I saw the form, yes.
8 Q. My question was did you check the
9 accuracy of the information?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. How did you do that? What did you do
12 to check?
13 A. Well, I needed to check. My main
14 concern was just one thing, we marked down there to
15 delete it. That's the only thing I checked.
16 Q. So you didn't check the subscriber
17 codes?
18 A. No, I did not.
19 Q. And where is it mailed if it's going to
20 be mailed to Experian?
21 A. I do not know.
22 Q. How many of these universal data forms,
23 manual ones, do you prepare in an ordinary month?
24 A. I do not know.
25 Q. Who would know?
64
1 A. You have to talk to our clerical people
2 that handle it. We have one person that usually
3 handles those.
4 Q. Is that part of your normal routine
5 duties to prepare these documents?
6 A. Mine personally?
7 Q. Right.
8 A. No, it is not.
9 Q. And are they mailed with any sort of
10 return receipt being requested so that you have an
11 evidence that it's actually been received?
12 A. No, they are not.
13 Q. Is there any follow-up done after they
14 are mailed to find out whether they've been
15 received and acted upon?
16 A. No, we do not.
17 Q. And who are the people within your
18 company who receive and respond to CVDs?
19 A. I do not know.
20 Q. Is there a supervisor or a management
21 person who would be responsible for that?
22 A. Chuck Sprague.
23 Q. And he's in Wisconsin?
24 A. No. He's in Chicago. He's in charge
25 of the clerical staff.
65
1 Q. And did you speak with him about this
2 case before coming here to testify?
3 A. No, I did not.
4 Q. Did you do anything to find out what
5 had occurred with respect to CVDs that might be
6 relevant to this case?
7 A. No, I did not.
8 Q. When this Ramona Peyton prepared this
9 universal data form, did you give her any
10 documentation that she should use to prepare it?
11 A. No, I did not.
12 Q. What instructions, as best you can
13 recall, did you give her?
14 A. Gave her the account number, and I said
15 prepare the form and make sure it gets deleted.
16 Q. Do you have the form in front of you?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. Do you have any personal information as
19 to where this Ms. Peyton would have got, for
20 example, the address, the current address that was
21 written down?
22 A. Can only assume from the computer
23 system.
24 Q. But you don't know?
25 A. Don't know for a fact.
66
1 Q. Can you look at any other documents to
2 indicate whether that's the address that your
3 company was showing in relationship to this account
4 when this document was prepared?
5 A. Yes. That is the address that was in
6 our computer system.
7 Q. And you know that by looking where?
8 A. Looking in window -- what we call
9 window two.
10 Q. This is from the same notes?
11 A. The notes.
12 Q. How about the first date of
13 delinquency?
14 A. She would have used that charge -- the
15 service date. It's also in those notes, in the
16 middle, service date.
17 Q. And the phrase service date is not -- I
18 mean, I do hundreds of credit reporting cases.
19 It's not one that I recognize as being a term. Can
20 you explain what service date is?
21 A. That is what we use as the -- that's
22 the new first date of delinquency that we pick up
23 from the consumer that we have to do on the tape
24 reporting.
25 Q. And where do you get that date from?
67
1 A. From the client, Associates.
2 Q. And in what form does that come to
3 you? Is that in sort of a hard file, or is it on a
4 tape?
5 A. Tape.
6 Q. Is there any other way that that date
7 of service could appear as 1/1/97, other than on a
8 tape received from Associates?
9 A. No.
10 MR. McLOON: That's all I have.
11 MR. MOTLEY: We'll reserve ours.
12 MR. SZWAK: Reading and signing?
13 MR. MOTLEY: If you will send it to me,
14 then I will take care of it.
15
16 (DEPOSITION CONCLUDED)
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
68
1 CHANGES AND SIGNATURE
2
3 PAGE LINE CHANGE REASON
4 _____ _____ __________________________________
5 _____ _____ __________________________________
6 _____ _____ __________________________________
7 _____ _____ __________________________________
8 _____ _____ __________________________________
9 _____ _____ __________________________________
10 _____ _____ __________________________________
11 _____ _____ __________________________________
12 _____ _____ __________________________________
13 _____ _____ __________________________________
14 _____ _____ __________________________________
15 _____ _____ __________________________________
16 _____ _____ __________________________________
17 _____ _____ __________________________________
18 _____ _____ __________________________________
19 _____ _____ __________________________________
20 _____ _____ __________________________________
21 _____ _____ __________________________________
22
23
24 I, BRIAN CUTLER, have read the
25 foregoing deposition and hereby affix my signature
69
1 that same is true and correct, except as noted
2 above.
3 __________________________
4 BRIAN CUTLER
5
6
7 THE STATE OF ________________ )
8
9 COUNTY OF ___________________ )
10
11 Before me, ______________________, on
12 this day personally appeared, BRIAN CUTLER, known
13 to me (or proved to me under oath or through
14 ____________) to be the person whose name is
15 subscribed to the foregoing instrument and
16 acknowledged to me that they executed the same for
17 the purposes and consideration therein expressed.
18
19 Given under my hand and seal of office
20 this ______ day of ___________, 1999.
21
22 __________________________
23 NOTARY PUBLIC IN AND FOR
24 THE STATE OF ___________
25
70
1 STATE OF LOUISIANA)
2 PARISH OF CADDO )
3 I, MELANIE C. HARRIS, do hereby
4 certify that, pursuant to the agreement hereinabove
5 set forth, there came before me at the time and
6 place set forth herein, the following named person,
7 to-wit: BRIAN CUTLER, who was by me duly sworn to
8 testify to the truth of witness' knowledge
9 concerning the matters in controversy in this
10 cause; that such witness was thereupon examined
11 under oath, and the examination transcribed by
12 computer-assisted transcription by me, and that the
13 deposition is a true record of the testimony given
14 by the witness.
15 I further certify that I am neither
16 attorney nor counsel for, nor related to or
17 employed by, any of the parties to the action in
18 which this deposition is taken and, further, that I
19 am not a relative or employee of any attorney or
20 counsel employed by the parties hereto, or
21 financially interested in the action.
22 SUBSCRIBED AND SWORN TO on this the
________ day of ___________________, A.D. 1999.
23
________________________________
24 Melanie C. Harris, CSR, CCR, RPR
Hanrahan Reporting Service, LLC
25 2800 Youree Drive, Suite C-330
Shreveport, Louisiana 71105